Gear Abby: Permit Rage, Ground Cloth Wars & Creative Freedom
- colin7931
- 22 minutes ago
- 38 min read
In this episode, Gear Abby comes in hot with two spicy debates (permits and tent footprints), cool everyone down with plein-air watercolor wisdom from guest artist Latasha Greene (Jitterbug Art), then map out U.S. options for European-style hut hiking.
As always: humor + hard facts + actually useful takeaways.
Question 1: “Permits are stupid.” (…and how to talk your brother off that ledge)
A listener asks for ammo to convince her brother that backcountry permits aren’t a scam. Shawnté explains that permits balance human impact, protect wildlife and other visitors’ solitude (that’s literally in the Wilderness Act), help rangers know who’s out there when things go sideways, and put money back into the exact places we use.
Gear Abby’s take: Rights come with responsibilities; paying and planning are part of stewardship.
Question 2: Ground Cloths/Footprints: Scam or Smart?
A fired up listener takes aim at ground cloths: “Footprints are BS. Prove me wrong.”Shawnté goes deep to show that footprints (or DIY ground cloths like Tyvek or polycro) extend tent-floor life, keep floors cleaner/drier (less condensation soak = lighter pack), and add versatility (lunch tarp, cowboy-camp sheet, quick “fly-first” pitching in storms with tents like the Fly Creek). Manufacturer footprints fit perfectly and clip in; DIY is cheaper and works great if cut to size.
Gear Abby’s take: Yes, it’s extra ounces. Also yes, holes in silnylon/Dyneema floors suck. Pick your pain.
Question 3: Plein-Air Watercolor for Bikepacking (ft. Latasha Green)
Listener Gabby wants help to build a tiny paint kit and advice on how to ditch perfectionism. While Gear Abby loves to paint in the backcountry, she’s no pro, so Shawnte brings in artist Latasha Greene to help!
Latasha’s go-kit:
Paper + palette with lid (preloaded pans or your tube colors)
Water brush pen (no open cup to spill/leave behind)
Cloth or scrap to wipe (low waste), optional pencil for quick outlines
Reality check: Dirt blows in; let it dry and brush it off later—watercolor reactivates. It’s the most “reusable” paint medium you’ll carry.
Mindset shifts to kill perfectionism:
Museum reality: there’s no single “right” way—spectrum > perfection.
No one is perfect on day one. Fill a sketchbook; compare page 1 vs. page last.
Nobody’s looking but you. Relax and keep painting.
Question 4: Euro-Style Trekking in the U.S. (Beds, Meals, Maybe Showers)
A couple of listeners want long hiking days that end with dinner, showers, and a real bed (bonus if West-ish).
Gear Abby’s Recommendations:
Yosemite High Sierra Camps (CA): Rustic tent cabins, meals included; tough lottery and post-COVID operational uncertainty—keep eyes on future seasons. Two camps historically had showers.
Rogue River Trail (OR): ~41 miles with multiple riverside lodges—build your own lodge-to-lodge itinerary; strong food/wine vibes.
DIY Coastal-Urban Trek (Bay Area, CA): String Half Moon Bay → SF → Marin using trails/parks/inns; not pure wilderness, but very fun and very scenic.
10th Mountain Division Huts (CO): Dozens of huts; mostly self-service (bring bag/food). Summer options exist; book early at huts.org.
Others noted: American Prairie huts (MT), Alaska Huts (AK), Mount Tahoma Trails huts (WA) (generally self-service). Most Euro-like for meals/beds: AMC High Mountain Huts (NH) on the AT. Breakfast & dinner included; bring your own adult bevvies.
Episode Bings (aka Footnotes)
How about it sponsors? Got some giveaways for us?
Remember, a real outdoor adventure includes nitroglycerin.
Bring it on Swifties!
Spit it out, Colin! The Pittman-Robertson Act!
Follow Tasha!
Click Here To Listen On Your Favorite Podcast App Or Just Click The Player Below!
Episode Transcript:
Shawnté Salabert
00:00:00.240 - 00:01:58.690
Fjallraven isn't here to conquer mountains, tame rivers, or beat the weather. We're here to go slowly, to tread carefully, and to cherish the visit. For us, the outdoor experience has never been a race to victory.
It's an ongoing journey to create equipment and memories that last for generations to come. Our mission is to inspire more people to move with nature. We do this by developing durable and functional equipment that never goes out of fashion.
What we really want is to make it easier for people to enjoy spending time in nature on nature's terms. This is our passion.
So let's use our vast experience and competence to help more people feel at home in nature, because when they do, they will take greater care of it. So get started on your Fjallraven journey by heading to fjallraven.com today. You got questions going out of your mind. Someone with answers.
Now that's hard to find, like the what and the why and the how stuff works or just where to go to avoid all the jerks she's Gear Abby. Gear Abby. Gear Abby. Advice that doesn't suck. Gear Abby.
Hello there, my outdoorsy friends, and welcome to Gear Abby, where we tackle the controversial, weird, obscure, and taboo topics that other outdoor podcasts refuse to touch.
I'm outdoor educator and writer Shante Salibert, and I'm here to answer your burning questions about our relationships with with outdoor people, products, places, and pastimes. And I want them all, because remember, there are no dumb questions, just smart advice. Here's how it works.
You're gonna send questions into DearGearAbbyMail.com and I'm gonna answer a couple each week here on the show.
And as always, the man you've been waiting for joining me today, my partner in gear, that's P. I. G. In case you are wondering, the producer of Gear Abby and a man who was born with a voice like a game show host, Colin.
Colin True
00:01:59.870 - 00:02:02.110
Well, thank you. Thank you. Glad. Happy to be here.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:03.150 - 00:02:07.550
Do you have any, like, I feel like I should. I want to win something now. Can I spin a wheel or something?
Colin True
00:02:07.550 - 00:02:08.910
Win Gear Abby's money.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:09.390 - 00:02:10.190
No, no.
Colin True
00:02:10.350 - 00:02:11.630
Win Gear Abby's gear.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:11.870 - 00:02:23.870
No, actually, you're not allowed to. No, no, no. Game show. Maybe if we should do a giveaway, you know, brands.
If brands that are listening, we should do some sort of fun, like year end or the beginning of the year giveaway.
Colin True
00:02:24.110 - 00:02:29.310
What about, you know, garage growing gear or gossamer gear, like, you know, some of our. Some of our sponsor pals.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:29.390 - 00:02:32.090
Yeah. Feel right then what like let's get on. Get on that.
Latasha Johnson
00:02:32.170 - 00:02:32.650
Yeah.
Colin True
00:02:32.970 - 00:02:43.890
This is our 13th episode. Which makes me wonder, is the Friday the 13th movie series, the most outdoor mainstream movie series of all time? Takes plant.
Takes place at a summer camp.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:43.890 - 00:02:45.050
It's at a summer camp. Yeah.
Colin True
00:02:45.050 - 00:02:46.170
Right. There's canoes.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:46.410 - 00:02:47.650
It's Camp Crystal Lake.
Colin True
00:02:47.650 - 00:02:52.610
Right, Camp Crystal Lake. Right. I mean, campfires. Yeah, right.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:52.610 - 00:02:56.250
It's very 80s. I feel like that it's like meatballs but with blood.
Colin True
00:02:57.020 - 00:02:57.860
Pretty much. Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:57.860 - 00:03:00.460
Yeah, I think you're right. It may be the most outdoorsy.
Latasha Johnson
00:03:01.340 - 00:03:01.740
I.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:01.820 - 00:03:12.300
You know, I. We might have to add it to the rotation of our pop culture moment. I mean, Vertical Limit reigns supreme. But you know what?
Actually, speaking of movies, I know you and I texted about it the other day.
Colin True
00:03:12.379 - 00:03:12.859
Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:13.100 - 00:03:21.740
I need to. We need just for a second here before we jump in, need to talk about the fact that they are making a thriller about Ultra running called Ultra.
Colin True
00:03:21.980 - 00:03:22.460
Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:22.460 - 00:03:44.200
And the premise for anybody who has not heard about this yet, is that a runner played by Shailene Woodley, who also, by the way, was in Adrift, based on Tammy Ashcraft's amazing book about being adrift in the ocean when her partner went overboard. Anyway, Shailene is being chased by somebody while running the Badwater Marathon. First of all, can I just say, like, nobody is running that fast for.
Colin True
00:03:44.200 - 00:03:49.640
A very slow chase. It's a very Jason Voorhees chase, actually. Or Michael Myers chase.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:50.200 - 00:03:56.920
Slow mo. Running through the sand, like, kind of maybe tripping every once in a while and just laying there and being very thirsty.
Colin True
00:03:57.380 - 00:04:06.500
I Probably same reaction as you. Like, I thought, like, this is not going to be good.
But then if you read about it, apparently either the writer or the director or maybe it's the same person apparently is an Ultra runner.
Shawnté Salabert
00:04:06.500 - 00:04:07.940
Oh, I know. I'm like, all right.
Colin True
00:04:08.100 - 00:04:17.460
You know, so I'm willing to give it benefit of the doubt that they'll get some of the. That's really how they handle the exposition to the audience who don't know what Ultra Running is.
Shawnté Salabert
00:04:17.460 - 00:04:17.780
Right.
Colin True
00:04:17.940 - 00:04:32.880
And if you are. If it's completely like just so cringy to Ultra Runners, then it's like you lost. I think you need to make it.
So, like, how do you get the message across about what they're doing while still making it feel natural to the Ultra runners watching it, like, that's the sweet spot where they need to live.
Shawnté Salabert
00:04:33.280 - 00:04:52.560
Or they can just go full vertical limit and maybe, maybe the person chasing her has got some nitroglycerin packs in their, you know, in their little Running vest. And it's a race against time. I mean, if you guys are still like in production and working on this, the storyline, just give us a call.
Dear gear abbymail.com we got some thoughts.
Colin True
00:04:52.800 - 00:05:01.620
I think that we need to get the Outdoor Industry association, the Outdoor Recreation Roundtable, the National Park Service. All these people need to be focused more on how to get more nitroglycerin into the outdoors.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:01.620 - 00:05:24.780
Yeah, screw the public lands. We got other things to focus about now. We've already given up on. Let's blow shit up. I love it. I feel. I feel alive right now. I'm ready.
Just thinking about ultra running and being chased and nitroglycerin has got me really pumped for today's episode. So what do you. Let's. Let's kick off with. You got something fun to start with? Perhaps I do.
Colin True
00:05:24.940 - 00:05:36.200
And I actually, I've only read the first sentence of this email because I was so excited about it. I didn't want to, you know, waste. I didn't want to waste the opportunity to just read it live because the first sentence. My favorite question so far.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:36.280 - 00:05:36.840
Okay.
Colin True
00:05:36.840 - 00:05:37.640
Are you ready?
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:37.720 - 00:05:38.200
Yes.
Colin True
00:05:39.000 - 00:05:47.320
Dear Gear Abby, my brother is an asshole who thinks permits are stupid. So right there I paused. I'm like, I gotta wait to read.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:47.640 - 00:05:49.240
Oh, like delayed gratification.
Colin True
00:05:49.240 - 00:05:50.440
You're like, this is amazing.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:50.680 - 00:05:52.600
You gotta savor each line of this email.
Colin True
00:05:53.960 - 00:05:54.560
That's right.
Latasha Johnson
00:05:54.560 - 00:05:54.840
This.
Colin True
00:05:54.840 - 00:06:27.060
This emailer goes on. His favorite line is, if public lands belong to the people, why do I have to pay to use them? He's poached a lot of trails and it drives me nuts.
Can you help me explain to his dumb ass why permit. My permits are helpful and why he should stop being a dick about it. Signed, mom likes me better. This is a 10 out of 10.
No notes, chef's kiss kiss email. Thank you. Mom likes me better. We have asshole dick. Dumbass. I mean, God, it's just. I'm playing all the hits.
Shawnté Salabert
00:06:28.060 - 00:06:33.660
It's. Yeah, that is. I. I will say, when this email came in, I was like, colin is gonna love seeing this.
Colin True
00:06:33.980 - 00:06:35.020
Oh, so good.
Shawnté Salabert
00:06:35.500 - 00:06:36.740
I was very happy to send that.
Colin True
00:06:36.740 - 00:06:39.260
I don't even care if you answered the question. I'm just happy.
Shawnté Salabert
00:06:39.420 - 00:06:44.620
We're just gonna read the. Read the question over and over for like seven minutes until the next topic.
Latasha Johnson
00:06:45.260 - 00:06:45.860
Oh, man.
Shawnté Salabert
00:06:45.860 - 00:07:38.230
Well, I have to say, usually it is you who helps us earn our E for explicit rating, but we're gonna give that crown to you better. But hey, I am. I am here for a little bit of sibling rivalry and I Want you to win this one. So hopefully this is going to help.
All right, why are permits helpful? Let me count the ways. So first, they help balance human impact not just on the landscape, but also on wildlife and other humans.
You know, in wilderness areas in particular, there is actually a specific mandate in the Wilderness act of 1964 to provide for, and I quote, outstanding opportunities for solitude. Like, I like the use of outstanding. They really, they're like, listen, some people really need to get a loan out there.
Let's, let's really pump it up for them. Just incredible, magnificent opportunities for solitude.
Colin True
00:07:38.550 - 00:07:44.150
I mean, really just was this like a last minute thing they're writing like, I don't know, man, like outstanding opportunities. That sounds good.
Shawnté Salabert
00:07:44.150 - 00:08:10.920
Put it in there. And the great thing is they don't really elaborate on what that means. So it's completely up to interpretation.
So if that means like dancing around in an alpine environment by yourself in a tutu, you know, have at it. That is what the Wilderness act wants for you.
So yeah, while you cannot have all of the space to yourself, you also shouldn't have to elbow through a Taylor Swift's concert worth of people just to see an elk or, you know, watch a sunset or whatever.
Colin True
00:08:10.920 - 00:08:14.480
Taylor Swift, she's. Is she a popular individual? Is that what you're saying there?
Shawnté Salabert
00:08:15.200 - 00:08:16.600
That's what I've heard, yeah.
Colin True
00:08:16.840 - 00:08:20.040
Okay. Any chance I can get to anger the Swifties I'm here for as well.
Shawnté Salabert
00:08:20.040 - 00:08:56.310
But everybody know that I didn't co sign that. I just want you all to know.
All right, so better permits also help track who might be out in the backcountry, which comes in handy in case of emergencies, wildfires, flash flooding. I think it's always a good idea to leave an itinerary with somebody at home.
But if a flash flood is imminent, unlike day two of your five day trip, you are much more likely to get help from a local ranger than who knows that you're in a specific slot canyon rather than your friend two states over who is not paying attention to anything other than their Instagram feed. So permits can be helpful for. For that.
Colin True
00:08:56.630 - 00:09:01.670
Wait a second. Is this is. Mom likes me better as her brother, Aaron Ralston.
Shawnté Salabert
00:09:02.229 - 00:09:03.790
Is it Aaron Ralston?
Colin True
00:09:03.790 - 00:09:07.670
Well, you didn't have much regard for permits. Clearly you know what happened to him?
Shawnté Salabert
00:09:08.070 - 00:09:20.450
Oh, wow. Yeah, that could be. We also don't know the gender of this person. So it could be like two brothers who are just having at it. I have no idea.
Like that's. That's exciting thing sometimes, Colin is what we don't know.
Colin True
00:09:21.170 - 00:09:32.130
You're right. I didn't. I. I am. I imposed gender probably through the use of expletives that I. That was. That was. You're like, that's too much on my right.
This is totally a dude.
Shawnté Salabert
00:09:32.130 - 00:09:35.570
You're like, do you know what it. Are you a brother? Do you know what it's like? Is that why.
Colin True
00:09:35.890 - 00:09:36.370
Yes.
Shawnté Salabert
00:09:37.890 - 00:10:12.030
Game recognized game and better. There is also the big matter of the majority of permit fees, minus the administrative fees withheld by services like rec.gov.
screw you, Bo Allen Hamilton. Go right back into those very same places that you enjoy recreating.
And I mean those very same places, because for national parks and forests and BLM areas, something called. We're getting. We're doing a lot of acts today. The federal Lands Recreation Enhancement act, otherwise known as Flia. That's the.
Colin True
00:10:12.110 - 00:10:13.070
I hope that's a thing.
Shawnté Salabert
00:10:13.070 - 00:11:40.060
Flia. It ensures that at least 80% of that money from permits and fees goes right back into that specific site.
Funding things like rangers, trail signs, search and rescue services, maintenance, repair, construction, habitat restoration, and waste management. So the permit system itself also generates data that influences future funding and staffing by showing trends of demand and use.
And so those permits are actually really useful for allocating money to these places that you want to be in. Hmm. Something to think about. Right. And so I'd say beyond all of that, better. Which, by the way, I think all of that is enough reason.
Remind your brother that with our rights, such as the presumed right to have access to these places, comes responsibility. That's right. It's a twofer. Caring for the places we love means supporting them.
So that could be by permit fees, by volunteering, by showing kids how to be good stewards and raising up the next gen funding for public lands and pushing for laws that improve all of this. They improve environmental protections, improve that funding, improve access to the outdoors. So, yeah, I get it.
Getting a permit might seem like a pain in the ass, but it would be a lot more painful to lose access to these places altogether because we stopped investing in them. All right? So don't be a dick.
Colin True
00:11:40.780 - 00:11:48.660
This. This is the underlying problem with the human powered outdoors world. Like, what's. What's the name of the. You may have even just said it if I didn't.
If I.
Shawnté Salabert
00:11:48.660 - 00:11:48.800
If I.
Colin True
00:11:49.030 - 00:12:46.190
You may be referring to something else, but what's the. What's the name of the. The hunt and fish tax revenue. They. They. Everything you buy. Like, you buy bullets. Like there's a.
There's a portion of that Goes towards. Like, towards the conservation movement, right? And it's like, there you go. Like, this is they.
A little bit of everything that hunters and fisher people do is going to go back to protecting the places where they get to do those activities. We are so selfish on the human powered side. We expect there to be trails.
We expect to be able to use any of the trails we want to use based on the thing that we want to do, and we have to pay $0 in order to do it. And it's just bullshit. It's like, come on, man. Like, I mean, I would love to have a tax put on any outdoor product.
Like, you want to buy a backpack, great. Like point 2% or 1% or whatever goes towards protecting these places. And then we could just like, be on par with some of these other categories.
So, come on, your brother's wrong. Rub this podcast in their face and, you know, bring it up. If he keeps it, bring it up. You know that you're right.
Shawnté Salabert
00:12:46.590 - 00:12:49.750
That's right. I like. I like the idea of rubbing a podcast and someone.
Colin True
00:12:49.750 - 00:12:50.510
You got to do it.
Shawnté Salabert
00:12:50.810 - 00:12:51.530
Very metaphysical.
Colin True
00:12:51.530 - 00:12:53.690
It's just a phone. And you're just like, rub. Like, look at this.
Shawnté Salabert
00:12:55.930 - 00:13:06.969
That was. I like that one. That was a good one. I loved, I think, that image of you, because I do get to watch you on the zoom screen every time we do this.
The image of you reading that will be forever imprinted in my mind.
Colin True
00:13:07.210 - 00:13:08.330
It was so wonderful.
Shawnté Salabert
00:13:09.130 - 00:13:15.450
Well, I don't want to break that beautiful high that you're experiencing, but we need to keep moving. So let's have another question.
Colin True
00:13:15.770 - 00:13:21.850
Well, the good news for me is that we're not breaking anything, because this next one's maybe as contentious as the first one.
Shawnté Salabert
00:13:22.870 - 00:13:23.190
Awesome.
Colin True
00:13:23.190 - 00:14:05.600
We're coming out hot here on Gear Abbey this episode, guys. All right, here's the email. Dear Gear Abby, let's be honest. Ground cloths under your tent are bullshit.
Any tent worth its ridiculous price doesn't need a barrier between it and the dirt under it. Making a ground cloth or a tarp or a footprint or whatever you want to call it.
A needless piece of gear that depletes your bank account while adding weight to your backpack. Am I. Am I wrong? No, I am not. But I'd still like to hear what you think. I love that. It's like, you. I'm not wrong, but what do you think about that?
Do you want to validate my opinion for me? Please, please validate my opinion for me. Anyway, signed pup Tent Pat. Wow.
Shawnté Salabert
00:14:05.600 - 00:14:07.840
A lot of people really worked up in this week's question.
Colin True
00:14:07.920 - 00:14:09.520
This is my favorite episode so far.
Shawnté Salabert
00:14:10.640 - 00:14:16.880
You love. Listen, this is full on fish shaking at the clouds. So this is your lane, Colin. I want you to really marinate in it.
Colin True
00:14:17.400 - 00:14:18.440
Get out of here, clouds.
Shawnté Salabert
00:14:19.960 - 00:15:28.840
Get out of your ground claws. Stupid footprints. All right, Pat, this. Just. Just take a moment. Take some deep breathing. There is no right or wrong here. There is only zool.
Just kidding. That's. That's a Ghostbusters reference. But let me tell you, there. There is a right or wrong. I used to be firmly in your pup tent camp.
Footprints, feet, prints, whatever. They felt expensive, unnecessary. I get it.
All I needed to do, though, was just pay attention, you know, to where I set my tent down and avoid stuff like SAP and rocks and sticks and I should be good, right? Right? Well, right. You think. You would think. Well, let's just say, and I am very careful with my tents.
After a handful of very frustrating incursions involving various tent floors, I have learned the true value of a footprint slash ground cloth. And I'm going to try to convince you to come over to the dark side with me and be less of a crab ass.
So, first of all, for anyone who is not familiar, like my dear friend Mo, who listens every single week, even though she is deeply not outdoorsy and she is delighted to learn things every week, she was really into the bidet episode Shout out to Mo. So anybody can listen to this podcast.
Colin True
00:15:28.920 - 00:15:32.000
I wasn't sure if Mo was getting a shout out or if she was taking some strays.
Shawnté Salabert
00:15:32.000 - 00:15:42.040
So, no, I shout out to Mo because I love that we. This is. I think this is testament to creating something that's entertaining, even for people who are like, ooh, gross.
Colin True
00:15:42.280 - 00:15:44.040
During this Mo, you're the target audience.
Shawnté Salabert
00:15:44.360 - 00:16:01.160
That's right. Mo actually runs. She does a podcast called Music, Music and Booze with Mo. So if you are into either of those things, give it a listen.
But yeah, man, we should. If we maybe one day I can have Mo on this podcast. We'll have to cross cross streams. I don't know.
Colin True
00:16:01.480 - 00:16:07.080
She sounds like she knows about music and booze. So we get what's gotta be a camp around the campfire question in that if we get one of those.
Shawnté Salabert
00:16:07.080 - 00:16:13.990
So, yeah, she did once go hiking with me in Muir woods in a pair of high heeled boots. So I feel like, well, you know.
Colin True
00:16:14.070 - 00:16:16.990
That'S a place where you can kind of get away with that if you just stick to the main sort of.
Shawnté Salabert
00:16:16.990 - 00:16:30.350
Loop there, you know, it's true, it's true. But yeah.
All right, so basically, for anyone like Mo who's not familiar with these things, a tent footprint is just an extra piece of material that gets laid down on the ground before you stake your tent, AKA redundancy.
Colin True
00:16:30.350 - 00:16:30.950
Keep going.
Shawnté Salabert
00:16:31.430 - 00:17:35.699
Oh, okay. All right, Pat. If the tent doesn't come with it, you can often just buy one separately from the manufacturer.
And the advantage these ones have over ground cloths.
And ground cloths can be things like tarps, plastic sheets, sheeting, or a piece of Tyvek, which is that stuff that indestructible post office mailers are made out of.
The advantage of a manufacturer one is that these are designed to fit perfectly under specific tents, and they include grommets or some other sort of attachment point that makes sure, you know, it connects to the tent and doesn't slip around. So, Pat, why should you consider joining me in making a little layer cake with your tent?
Well, the biggest reason is that you're going to prolong the life of it by preventing cuts and holes and abrasions and stuff like SAP getting stuck in there. Tent floors, at least in backpacking tents, are generally made out of Sil nylon or Dyneema, and neither of them is particularly puncture resistant.
So popping something underneath, you know, just sliding something under there, serves as a first line of defense. And it's honestly gonna prolong the magic. Why, Colin, you look like you want to say something.
Colin True
00:17:35.699 - 00:17:42.480
So the counterpoint that means that new tent day comes way less frequently. Just want to say, all right.
Shawnté Salabert
00:17:43.440 - 00:17:47.440
Oh. So you're like, oh, damn, I can't. You want to just be constantly.
Latasha Johnson
00:17:47.440 - 00:17:47.720
You.
Shawnté Salabert
00:17:47.720 - 00:17:51.480
I know you call it. I know you don't like to just buy gear for gear's sake, but if.
Colin True
00:17:51.480 - 00:17:59.200
You poke a hole in your tent, you gotta be like, you get. The first thought is like, this is gonna suck for however long I'm out here. The second thought is, oh, I get to buy a new tent.
Shawnté Salabert
00:18:00.880 - 00:21:08.420
Tents are expensive, man. So. Yeah, no, but it. You know, as someone who owns like four or five tents, but they're all different.
In my defense, I have like the big four person tent. Sure, I have. I do have two different, no, three different backpacking tents, but they're for different seasons and different uses. In my defense.
Anyway, the other main reason I use a ground cloth, Colin and Pat and I usually use Tyvek or a lightweight sheet of Polycro, which is just a lightweight plastic. It's very thin and surprisingly durable. I get it from Six Moon Designs. I actually bought it from Garage Grown Gear Shout Out Yeah, shout out.
But yeah. The other main reason I use those is to just keep the tent floor clean and dry. Dry.
Very specifically, dry from condensation, which occurs because there's a temperature differential between your hot little body when it's sleeping and the colder ground underneath you. And so that also dew, frost, of course, rain, any of that.
And a dry tent floor means a lighter and cleaner tent and pack, because you're going to be putting this thing back in your pack at some point. And I think it's especially helpful with sil nylon tents because they take forever to dry. It is. They are very heavy in your pack when they're wet.
So I like to reduce the amount of water I'm getting on there. I also honestly like the versatility that comes with a footprint. Sometimes I'll pull it out if I want to, like, lay down at lunch or take a break.
I've used them as sun shades before in the desert. They're really great if you decide to cowboy camp one night. I've done that quite a bit. We talked about that back in episode two, Our Infancy.
It's a great way to test possible temp position and flatness before you set it up. Um, and so you don't have to move it around, which is especially hard if you're just using a trekking pole tent and not a freestanding.
And if you have a tent where a fly fly first pitch, which is a hard thing to say if that's possible. Like a big Agnes Fly Creek, you have amazing options for quick setup in bad weather that keeps your tent body dry.
And this saved my ass on the PCT many times where I was when I was using my fly Creek week. I could just pop it up really quick and you put the fly over the footprint and it's so much quicker than setting up a whole tent. So. Okay.
Also, Pat, you don't need to deplete your bank account to use a ground cloth. I think that's a misunderstanding.
So, yes, the ones made by manufacturers for specific tents are a little pricier, but that's why I use Tyvek or I use Polycro. I know a lot of industrious hikers have actually just rolled up to construction sites and it's been like, hey, do you guys have any extra Tyvek?
And that's how they got their Tyvek. So that's cost $0. Just a little bit of guts. So, yeah, there you have it. I mean, for me, carrying a little bit of extra material to protect my.
As you said, ridiculously priced tent is absolutely worth it. And. But hey, you do you. And don't send me a sad email when you rip your expensive tent floor on some random sharp object one night. Okay?
Man, what a day. Today I can't. We had two very confrontational emails which I know, wonderful. Kind of delighted you. More than kind of delighted you. You're just like.
You look. You're glowing right now.
Colin True
00:21:08.420 - 00:21:17.700
Colin, you know, I love, I love the positivity of the outdoors, but sometimes, you know, it's a little too nicey nice. You know, let's get, let's get serious. Opinions exist, people. All right?
Shawnté Salabert
00:21:18.020 - 00:21:26.100
They do. Oh man. Well, you know, maybe we could slide into something. Slide into. I don't know. We're sliding onto the ground cloth.
We're sliding into something a little more gentle.
Colin True
00:21:26.100 - 00:21:32.270
What do you have? Well, you didn't neglected that if you have a ground cloth, you can create a slip inside in the backcountry or very short one.
Shawnté Salabert
00:21:33.140 - 00:21:35.860
Perfect. We'll slip and slide right into the next question.
Colin True
00:21:35.940 - 00:21:51.620
Okay. All right, here we go. Dear Gear Abby, I just started listening to the show and I love it. Okay, this is good positivity. I'm into this positivity.
You guys crack me up. I love that part right there too. We're gonna break this down like one line at a time. Cause so far this is a great.
Shawnté Salabert
00:21:51.700 - 00:21:55.140
Really good emails today. I like to be validated.
Colin True
00:21:55.780 - 00:22:31.770
You guys crack me up and I feel like I learned something new every episode.
My question to you is, you talked about taking watercolors on a rafting trip in one of the episodes and I wonder if you have any tips for how to create a portable watercolor kit that I can take on bikepacking trips. Sorry, I was going to say backpacking. This writer, this emailer says bikepacking trips.
Also, any pointers on trying to let go of perfectionism when I'm trying to paint outside? I'm new to it and I'm not very good, but I still love trying. Thanks. Signed Gabby. Sorry, I couldn't think of something creative.
Well, I mean, you have the Gabby Abby thing right there, you know.
Shawnté Salabert
00:22:31.770 - 00:22:33.410
Oh, I didn't even think about that.
Colin True
00:22:33.490 - 00:22:35.250
It combines your Abby and it's Gabby.
Shawnté Salabert
00:22:35.250 - 00:23:21.890
You have a great name, Gabby. Big fan. That's okay. Save your creative energy for painting.
So, Gabby, I thought about answering your question myself and telling you about my crappy plain hair painting setup and telling you how I'm still not the best at being kind to myself when it comes to my own painting, but then I thought of a much better person to answer your question.
And that is my friend Latasha Dunston, who is an incredible painter, illustrator, and mural artist who's actually helped me grow in my own outdoor watercolor pursuits.
Her artwork has appeared on the side of hotels, wine bottles, socks, koola cloths, and barrel clothing, and in Diana Helmuth's book How to Suffer Outside and a thousand other places. She's super legit and I'm so excited to have her on the podcast. Welcome, Tasha.
Latasha Johnson
00:23:22.620 - 00:23:28.780
Hi. Also, since I've known you, I've gotten married, so my last name is Green now.
Shawnté Salabert
00:23:28.780 - 00:23:50.270
Oh my gosh, that's right. It's okay, Tasha Green. That's true. I. I apologize. She goes by Jitterbug Art online, so that's how you could find her as well.
But Tasha, let's dig in with the first part of Gabby's question, which is what are the key elements of a good portable watercolor setup? I know you've done a lot of plein air painting.
Latasha Johnson
00:23:51.140 - 00:25:43.490
Yeah, it is my favorite way to be outside because I can sit still and relax. So I always joke with people that plein air painting is going to be the most accessible and affordable outdoor sport you will partake in.
And so when it comes to what it is that you need, it is very basic and there are companies that create kits for this type of thing. But you can also just be scrappy and use what you have and bring, you know, all the pieces together, which is what I did for a really long time.
So you'll need watercolor paper, a brush, and water. I prefer to use a water brush pen, which is a combination like water vessel paintbrush combo, so you don't need to have like a little cup.
And it also will prevent you from throwing your paint water into nature, which you don't want to do. You need a palette with paint, be it squeezy paint that you squeezed into the little pockets yourself.
Or maybe the palette came pre loaded with paint, preferably a palette with a lid on it. But again, we're not going to be particular because you can just wipe the dirt off later. Trust me, I have.
I get so much dirt in my palettes like it is a mess. And then I like to use just my clothing to clean my brush off. Just again, low waste.
When we're outdoors, we don't want to be packing a lot of trash with us. But if you don't want to do that, bring that. Bring a napkin or a paper towel or a washcloth or piece of fabric or something like that.
That you can clean your brush off on and then your imagination, I guess.
Shawnté Salabert
00:25:43.490 - 00:25:44.170
Or pencil.
Latasha Johnson
00:25:44.740 - 00:25:51.060
Pencil, if you want to draw it first. But that's not mandatory. You can just straight up start painting. I do that all the time.
Shawnté Salabert
00:25:51.700 - 00:26:12.540
I do. You know what I do?
Bring a pencil, a little mechanical pencil with me, because I like to sketch the, like, the outlines of things and then do my very bad job painting them afterwards. What was you.
So when you just to, like, expand on this a little bit, you mentioned that your setup now is probably pretty different than when you first started. Like, when you did first start getting out there doing the plein air stuff.
Colin True
00:26:12.540 - 00:26:12.780
What.
Shawnté Salabert
00:26:12.850 - 00:26:27.810
What. What was your setup? Because I feel like this is something we'll all relate to.
Because I think it can be intimidating looking online and being like, oh, these little paint kits are kind of expensive sometimes. And, you know, do I need all that if I don't even feel comfortable doing this yet? Like, what did you use when you first started?
Latasha Johnson
00:26:29.090 - 00:27:01.150
So I am a little bit of an anomaly because I did go to art school, so I have an abundance of art materials and put that there. And so I already had watercolor paint tubes from school.
And I started painting when I moved to Denver, even though I. I kind of learned about it when I lived in Richmond. But then I didn't really go out and do it until I had moved to Denver. And what I had was, funny enough, it was a watch palette.
Shawnté Salabert
00:27:01.710 - 00:27:03.550
A watch palette? What does that even mean?
Latasha Johnson
00:27:03.950 - 00:27:31.520
It is. It was like a little. I wish I had it close to me. It was. It's like a little circle, almost like pill case. Oh, that had a little lid on it.
Or almost like. Like a very large pocket watch is kind of like the. The vessel. And it had these, like, four sections.
And then I had glued that onto a piece of Velcro and then I put it on my wrist.
Shawnté Salabert
00:27:31.600 - 00:27:32.480
Oh, I love that.
Latasha Johnson
00:27:33.040 - 00:28:36.830
That's what I used for a few years until I was like, you know what? I want more colors. Because I was in this limited palette phase back then. I was, I want more colors.
So I went to my local art store and got like a. I would say 5 inch by 2 inch palette that had paint in it already and it had a lid on it. And that's what I used. And I just used my regular sketchbook.
I would just pull out a big old chunky sketchbook, and I would use a regular brush and a jar with a lid on it and like, a little, like, capers jar, a little olive jar. Reusable moments, very bougie. Yes. Capers. Locks in this house. But, yeah, that was my setup.
And I would just pop it in a, like, dust bag and then pop that into my backpack. If I needed a waterproof moment, a Ziploc was the solution. I love it.
Shawnté Salabert
00:28:36.830 - 00:28:44.750
I love it. Yeah. I used to use the jar, like, a little jam jar for my water, because I was like, I gotta carry it home, just like you were saying.
I can't just be whooping this all over nature, you know?
Colin True
00:28:45.790 - 00:28:46.190
Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:28:46.190 - 00:28:56.200
And I think I use. I still use, actually, for my.
I bring little sheets of watercolor paper, but then I put it on a piece of cardboard that I put a rubber band around, and that's, like, my little easel.
Latasha Johnson
00:28:57.070 - 00:30:04.800
I love. I've never thought of the rubber band trick. I'm always using tape, which is just.
And if you're listening and what you don't know about watercolor is that it's a reusable medium. Unlike oil paint or acrylic or gouache. Those paints, once they dry, you cannot reactivate them. They are plastic. You throw it away. It's done.
Whereas with watercolor, it is reusable. Like, so. Even the palette, not just the.
Well, that has the little colors, but your palette, the little flat part that you're mixing your colors on and making a mess on, when that dries, that's all reusable color. So you just continue to use that and continue to add to it, which is the beauty of watercolor.
And say you get a bunch of dirt that blew into your palette, because that happens when you plein air paint. You're out with the elements. You are at the wheel. Beck and Will. It's going to rain. It's going hail, it's going do what it's going to do.
Essentially, you just let it dry, and then literally, the grains of dirt or sand just dry right to the top of the palette, and then you brush it off. Oh, it's kind of awesome.
Shawnté Salabert
00:30:04.960 - 00:30:31.820
Oh, man. All right, well, let's get to the second part of Gabby's question.
And this one spoke to me a lot, because it's something I actually struggle with, and it's that how to let go of perfectionism in your art practice, especially when you're learning a new medium like this. I mean, to me, watercolor has so much potential, but I feel like I just have not mastered any angle of it yet. But I still love it.
Sounds like Gabby's in that same place. Like, how can we work on being maybe more present and not so worried about, like, making Something perfect.
Latasha Johnson
00:30:32.700 - 00:31:29.380
I. So I like to disarm my students because I do do a. I teach a plein air painting class.
So I like to disarm my students by asking, has anyone ever gone to an art museum before? Normally, everyone raises their hand, and then I go, have you ever been in this art museum and have you seen a piece of.
And you're like, I feel like I could do that or my niece could do that or my baby can do that. Like, what the heck? And you just like, kind of question, like, how did this get into a museum?
That right there shows you the validity of just this spectrum of art. Right? There is no one right or wrong way to express yourself via art.
And that shows when you walk through museums and you see the wide range of just, like, these big photorealistic things to like, one big blue canvas.
Shawnté Salabert
00:31:30.660 - 00:31:33.140
Like. Yeah, the rocks. You know what I mean?
Latasha Johnson
00:31:33.140 - 00:32:00.410
Like, literally, it'll be like a white canvas with a red dot in the middle period. Like, fine arts, contemporary. Like, there it is, a spectrum. So I would.
I would suggest anyone who approaches creativity through a lens of perfectionism to shake it off. Because. Because let's also be realistic. Do you know anyone who has tried something and is literally perfect at it the first time?
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:01.450 - 00:32:03.690
No, Literally. That's certainly not me.
Latasha Johnson
00:32:03.850 - 00:32:42.610
Let's be so for real right now. Like, that is something that helps me get. Get rid of my perfectionism throughout my creative practice. Because no one is perfect. Art is a spectrum.
My 60% effort in an art piece is someone else's. 100%. Right? Like, it is. It is that spectrum where we don't really need to reach for anything.
We just need to be ourselves, find our own creative voice. So I would tell her to just keep painting also. Ain't nobody looking at it but you. Relax, relax.
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:43.650 - 00:32:44.410
Call me. Your bonds.
Latasha Johnson
00:32:44.410 - 00:32:58.800
Garrett. Gabby. Yeah, like, it's gonna be okay. It has to look ugly in order to look. Here's my challenge to you.
Fill the sketchbook and then look at the first page versus the last page, and then you can be critical of yourself.
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:59.920 - 00:33:17.160
Oh, I like that, man. Tasha, I just wanna do a whole podcast with you. Tasha talks creativity. Oh, I love it.
I could ask you about a thousand more questions, but I think here's. Here's the challenge to the listeners. Please send in more questions about creativity so I can have Tasha back on again. Again. Yeah.
Latasha Johnson
00:33:17.720 - 00:33:20.920
I love art. I've been an artist my whole life, so.
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:21.400 - 00:33:52.660
You have. And you're. And you're amazing. I love watching. I have a piece of your art in my home. I actually think I have a few things in my house.
I have a kula cloth with your artwork on it. I think of you every time I go to the bathroom. But yeah, thanks so much Tasha. Everybody listening. Please go find Latasha online. She is amazing.
You can find her@jitterbugart.com and jitterbugart on Instagram. Pick up Diana Helmuth's book. But yeah, Tasha is incredible. You're going to see so much more of her. Always and forever. I believe so. Thanks Nasha.
Latasha Johnson
00:33:52.980 - 00:33:53.620
Thank you.
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:56.180 - 00:36:14.290
While daydreaming about future backpacking trips, I had an epiphany. Maybe I could have an even better time out there if I just lightened my pack. That's when I decided to try out my very first trekking pole tent.
Gossamer Gears the One. And it was a match made in ultralight heaven.
Weighing in at just 18 ounces, the one sets up in minutes using just trekking poles and a handful of stakes.
And also, the One didn't just lighten my pack, it simplified my camp setup so that I had more time to enjoy the natural beauty all around me and allow me to spend more time with my favorite bidet. If you know, you know Gossamer Gear designs products for people on the move rooted in a legacy of simplification.
Their philosophy is that taking less allows you to do more.
And if you want to test this philosophy yourself, head over to gossamergear.com and use code GearAbby at checkout to save $20 off your order of $100 or more. Well, hello my outdoorsy friends. It's your favorite time of the week. Time to head to the official Gear garage of Gear Abby. That's Garage Grown Gear.
Garage Grown Gear, AKA GGG is here to make sure all of you, that's all of gear. Abby's outdoorsy friends can get the newest outdoor stuff that they need for their next adventure. What kind of stuff, you ask?
Well, today we're going to get a little eclectic with a mashup of new and kind of weird stuff available right now on ggg. First up, we've got electronics. We're going to keep our electronics charged with a Nitecore NB10000 plus power bank.
I actually have one of these that I bought on GGG and it is awesome.
Second, you're going to preserve your carbide trekking pole tips with a set of Arctic FL Fox Trekking paws by Preservation Dogs, which is for trekking poles, not for dogs. And lastly, if you love your shorts but still want dry legs. Pick up a pair of minimalist rain pant legs by three.
Full gear, little bit of rain pant chap action. Yeah, you can get in on that. Whatever you're looking for. Garage grown gear and Gear Abbey are the perfect outdoor combo.
So get shopping by heading over to garagegrowngear.com right now. Now. Oh, man, I love having Tasha on. I just, I love what she had to say too. It's. Especially after having like two salty questions.
It's really nice to have someone come on and just be like, really encouraging.
Colin True
00:36:14.450 - 00:36:19.410
We needed a little pallet cleanser, right? A little reminder of, like, why we go outside. Thank you, Tasha.
Latasha Johnson
00:36:19.410 - 00:36:20.010
It's true.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:20.010 - 00:36:24.570
She's the best. All right, well, we have time for one more question. Let's get into it.
Colin True
00:36:24.570 - 00:36:36.030
Okay, last question for this episode. Dear Gear Abby, My wife and I trekked the Haute Rote Hout. Rote Hout Hout route. It's H A U T E. Is that like Terre Haute.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:36.030 - 00:36:38.070
Terre Haute. Haute couture.
Colin True
00:36:39.270 - 00:36:40.070
We'll say Haute.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:40.390 - 00:36:41.030
Let's do it.
Colin True
00:36:41.030 - 00:36:59.430
The Haute route or Haute Route, whatever. They hiked this route for our honeymoon and the Camino before we settled down and had babies.
Are there any long distance, multi day treks in the United States where you hike all day, but. Oh, this is great. But end with dinner, shower, and a real bed each night? I'm with these people also.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:59.430 - 00:37:01.090
We Southern California.
Colin True
00:37:01.250 - 00:37:06.850
So bonus points for any that are on this side of the Rockies. Thank you. Sign. Jimmy and Katie.
Shawnté Salabert
00:37:07.730 - 00:37:20.210
I love that. This actually reminds me about last week's question about. I think it was last week about being bougie, but like, wanting to get more outdoorsy.
So see, listen, this podcast isn't just for dirt bags. I think we've established that.
Colin True
00:37:22.050 - 00:37:23.970
Or Killian Jornay. It's not for him either.
Shawnté Salabert
00:37:23.970 - 00:37:34.310
You know, it is, but it is. I mean, he doesn't need to learn anything, but he can come on as much as he wants and tell us his insights into mountain mind. Mountain mindset.
Colin True
00:37:35.270 - 00:37:41.070
I bet you spent more consecutive nights on trail than Killian. That's gonna be my. That'd be my. I put my odds in your favor.
Shawnté Salabert
00:37:41.070 - 00:37:44.870
It's only because I'm slow. It's only because I walk at a human pace.
Colin True
00:37:44.870 - 00:37:46.230
More legit. Killian.
Shawnté Salabert
00:37:46.310 - 00:37:54.790
All right, listen, Killian, if you ever want to come back on whether or not you want to talk about pooping in the Alps, it's an open invitation.
Colin True
00:37:55.990 - 00:37:57.150
Pooping in the Alps. Pod.
Shawnté Salabert
00:37:57.150 - 00:38:51.850
Pooping in the Alps. Pork guy. He's probably like, why did I ever go on that podcast? Listen, Kimmy. Kimmy and JD Is what I was just gonna say.
Kimmy, JD Your alter egos that are going to be hiking in the U.S. now, Jimmy and Katie, I hate to break it to you, but the Europeans do have centuries more experience being fancy in the out of doors.
The downside over there is that you are hard pressed to find anything approximating the, you know, vast wilderness we have here in the States, since they've developed much of their mountain landscape. But there are some options here at home that might get you a little closer to belting out the Sound of Music while you're eating delicious cheeses.
Not that you need an excuse to do that. You could do that anytime you want, just so you know. But let's start with close to home.
You mentioned you live in Southern California, as do I and Colin. So the most iconic option is going to be a place Colin still hasn't been to in Yosemite National Park.
Colin True
00:38:52.170 - 00:38:52.970
Not familiar.
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:53.370 - 00:39:26.870
That's right. He's never heard of it. But it's the High Sierra Camps in the park and they're located it along a roughly, you know, 50 mile loop.
The camps are a bit rustic, so you stay in tent cabins instead of mountain huts. And you, but you are, you're fed breakfast, you're fed dinner. They don't serve adult beverages, so you'd have to hike in your own.
If you want to reminisce about, you know, drinking wine with mountain goats or whatever, there is one big catch, or actually two, and they're big. First you have to. There's a lottery system and you have to win that before you can even pay for a reservation.
Colin True
00:39:26.950 - 00:39:29.910
And you also get a billion dollars if you win because it's the lottery.
Shawnté Salabert
00:39:30.070 - 00:39:39.410
It's not true. That is true. We're going to have to, we're going to start hiring a lawyer to vet everything you say, Colin, we don't have that kind of money yet.
We need more sponsors.
Colin True
00:39:39.810 - 00:39:42.450
I won the lottery. All I got is this hut.
Shawnté Salabert
00:39:42.530 - 00:39:44.850
Oh, I got his hantavirus hut.
Colin True
00:39:46.130 - 00:39:46.490
Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:39:46.490 - 00:41:53.830
So there's that. And then also, this is kind of a big one, the concessionaire. So they're not run by Yosemite National park, they're not run by the federal government.
They're run by a concessionaire.
And that concessionaire charged with running the camps has dropped the ball since COVID And it is, they keep saying, like, like, like this past year they opened up reservations for 20, 25. And then they were like, just kidding we gotta fix the water. Like every year it's something.
So it's hard to say if or when they'll actually open again. Technically reservations are I think open right now on the website for 2026. So you know, shoot your shot.
You could go for something a little different.
Go further north in California you could consider hiking the 41 mile Rogue River Trail which has has five different lodges and so much wine conveniently located along the way. It's sort of like a choose your own adventure style fancy pants hike if that's your thing.
And in that spirit you could also just string together your own adventure, which I'm a huge fan of. I've done this quite a bit by walking any distance between I'd say sort of the Half Moon Bay area and up into Marin County.
Going through San Francisco, it isn't as straightforward as just following a trail like the Rogue River Trail would be be. But the upside is that all those hills in San Francisco might remind you of the Alps. So you know, there's a plus.
But there are some more traditional hut systems in the states, especially out here in the west. And these are typically though out west they're typically self service.
So the big ones actually in the Rockies, you mentioned staying west of the Rockies. But if you're willing to go in them, There are the 10th Mountain Division huts or super famous famous.
And they have almost 40 backcountry huts all with slightly different amenities. I think only 25 of them are open in the like for summer. Most people, people actually love skiing into these huts. So it's much more popular.
Yeah, huge, huge. But you know, you'll need to bring your own sleeping bag and provide your own food. But you get a hut, you get a vibe.
These are really popular so you do need to book them in advance via the amazingly named website.
Colin True
00:41:53.900 - 00:41:57.620
Website huts.org simplicity. Gotta love it.
Shawnté Salabert
00:41:57.620 - 00:43:24.190
Yeah, just tell me what it is, let me get there. And you also do need to figure out what route you want to take.
So there are tons of options to connect any number of these huts, which I again, I think trip planning is fun. Might not be your thing. There might be, there's guided trips that people do lead in the mountains.
So if you want to leave the grunt work to somebody else, you can try a guided trip. There's also the much smaller American Prairie hut system in Montana. There's the Alaska Huts Association Cabins and Utah Yurts up near Anchorage.
And then there's the ski or snowshoe in Mount Tahoma Trails association huts in Washington State So those are all options again, all self sufficient. So not quite the fancy pants that you may be looking for.
So I'd say the closest thing you're going to get here in the States, you're going to have to go all the way to the east coast to remember what it was like to roll up to some rustic location and you know, eat bread and some home cooked meals with a bunch of strangers. So that's going to be the Appalachian Mountain Club huts. That's their high mountain huts along the Appalachian Trail.
And this is going to be the closest you're going to get here. So you're going to have a place to stay.
You're going to be staying there with a bunch of different people from probably around the world and you're going to get fed breakfast and dinner and you do have to card in your own alcohol because we am your, you know, we Americans are puritans after all. So come prepared with a flask at the very least.
Colin True
00:43:25.230 - 00:43:32.990
Yeah. And the AMC one is the best one. I mean, and also none of these, like they're back to the original question. Like you're looking for the hot shower.
Like, you know, you're not getting that.
Shawnté Salabert
00:43:32.990 - 00:43:34.750
You'Re not getting that. Bring a solar shower.
Colin True
00:43:35.150 - 00:44:30.410
You know, I spent a lot of time in the White Mountains and the White Mountain huts are spectacular.
They're all staffed by what they affectionately call themselves the crew, which is croo and just wonderful people who are hauling up and down the very, very steep and direct trails of the White Mountains. Large amounts of food and everything else. They're just.
And then if, even if you're not staying over, if you're just day hiking, you can pop in and fill up your water and you know, get snacks. So. And it's. Yeah, that's that I would say that's probably the closest. So you're not getting the, the European thing is just so special.
I remember going just doing like a quick trail run or a hike or something the first time I went over to Switzerland and then realizing like you're passing this thing and like I can walk in here on the way down from my hike and get like, like weiner schnitzel or a sausage and a beer and you're like, this is amazing, like life. Right. But then to your point, they don't have the quite the same thing on the wilderness side.
But we need to find some sweet somewhere a little in the middle. We need something in the middle. Where's the middle?
Latasha Johnson
00:44:30.410 - 00:44:30.690
There.
Shawnté Salabert
00:44:31.170 - 00:45:34.000
Yeah. I mean I think the Rogue River Trail could be a good option for y' all because it is a, you know, it's, it's an actual trail.
It's 41 miles, five lodges to pick from. There you go stay in a lodge every night with, with hot water. So it's, you know, it's not going to be.
The lodges aren't as rustic as in Europe, but it's, I think that's, they are still definitely like cabin y lodges. So I think that's probably what you want to try first because I don't think those High Sierra camps are opening anytime soon.
And I think two of them do have showers, though I think May Lake and I can't remember the other one, but two of the High Sierra camps have showers. The rest of them, you're just dirt bagging it. That's it for this episode of Gear Abby.
Until next time, send your burning questions about your relationships with outdoor people, products, places and pastimes over to us at tv here gearabbymail.com and I'll do my best to answer them. Or find someone else like Latasha who can.
And of course, head over to your podcast listening service of choice and subscribe, rate and review to support the pod and personally make my day and follow us on Instagram. If you like seeing poorly made reels.
Colin True
00:45:34.160 - 00:45:36.920
By yours truly, you need to be easier on yourself.
Shawnté Salabert
00:45:36.920 - 00:45:49.850
Your reels are great, so it's like at this point they're intentionally bad. But if you want to want to see two cheetahs making love, head over to Gear Abby Pot on Instagram. In the meantime, today's episode was.
Colin True
00:45:49.850 - 00:45:51.210
And by cheetahs, she means people.
Shawnté Salabert
00:45:51.690 - 00:46:08.340
No, I don't. Don't get me banned from Instagram. Today's episode was produced by David Karstad and this guy, Colin True.
Art direction provided by the wonderful Sarah Gensert. I'm Shantae Salibair, and remember, there are no dumb questions, just smart advice. Ice.
