Rab: Winning While Others Wander
- colin7931
- Jul 7
- 47 min read
Today it's the last interview that we recorded at GOA Connect in Reno last month. This time Colin and Eoin are chatting with Jon Frederick of Rab.
Jon talks about why Rab has found more traction in the US when other EU based brands have struggled to enter the market. They also discuss Rab's current product initiatives and what Jon would like to see out of the national trade show scene.
Then Shawnté Salabert calls in with an update from her three week hike on the JMT to help Colin process his discovery that he no longer likes hiking.
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Episode Transcript:
Colin True
00:00:00.560 - 00:01:17.200
Before we get started today, I want to highlight the need for resources and donations as a result of this past weekend's flooding in the Texas Hill Country. Please head to the link in the show notes that was provided by the Texas Outdoor Recreation alliance and help out today.
Your donations are most welcome in their time of need. Thank you very much. Welcome to the Rock Fight where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows and sometimes agree to disagree.
This is an outdoor podcast that aims for the head. I'm Colin True and today we're bringing you the last conversation that we had at Geo Connect last month, this time with Rabs John Frederick.
But first, Shantae may be out hiking for the next few weeks, but be sure to come back to the Rock Fight this Wednesday to hear Friend of the Rock Fight Emily Holland fill in as guest co host to help me run through some outdoorsy headlines.
And tomorrow, Tuesday, July 8, you get to crack open a brand new open container with Doug Schnitzfahn and make sure you're following open container on your favorite podcast app so you never miss what Doug has to say. And lastly, please make sure you're following the Rock Fight and open container on your favorite podcast app.
If you are an Apple podcast listener and you leave us a written review, then send us a screenshot of that written review to myrockfightmail.com we'll send you a bunch of Rock Fight stickers. All right, stick around. We'll be right back.
Chris DeMakes
00:01:17.200 - 00:01:20.920
Welcome to the Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Rock Fight.
Colin True
00:01:22.760 - 00:01:37.260
You're listening to Rock Fight Radio. You got DJCT with you. And if you think the hitmakers at Fitz couldn't also write show tunes, then you'd be wrong.
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Colin True
00:02:39.110 - 00:05:16.080
And now back to the show. Today's episode of the Rock Fight is presented by Oboz.
Oboz wants to share their love of hiking and we want to help them by uncovering all the different reasons that we love to take the long walk, including the following. Number one, you realize that your backpack, it's heavier than your emotional baggage. So you can just let that shit go is what I'm saying here.
Just let it go. Number two, that moment of Zen when it's just you and the trail, no one else is out there with you. You're just by yourself. You gotta love that.
It's what happens when you're out there. Ooh, just solo on the trail, no one else around. It's amazing.
Number three, finally, because once you go hiking, you just can't shut up about how awesome hiking is. Number four, hiking means the Katabatic collection featuring the Catabatic LT from Oboz.
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And if you're in the market for a new pair of katabatic LTS, be sure to head to nwild.com to get shopping n Wild, an online outdoor retailer based in my hometown of Lancaster, Pennsylvania. And number five, this hiking appreciation moment is brought to you by Oboz of Bozeman, Montana.
Oboz is the maker of premium quality footwear for the trail and the cupid to the outdoor world. Oboz Love hiking.
Over the past year, we've talked quite a bit here on the Rock Flight about brands from outside the US trying to gain traction in the States to varying degrees of success and or failure. But one has actually made some headway in that regard, and that would be the UK's RAB.
As it turns out, there's good reason for that, starting with an owner who understands that you have to do the work you need to get into the market. You want to grow in yourself and figure out what resonates about your brand with a new audience.
So for our last Goa Connect conversation, I wanted to see what more we could learn from the folks at RAB.
And it turns out that John Frederick, RAB's group marketing officer, who had just prior to Goa Connect been announced as returning to the US to oversee the business here.
Agree to sit down and chat with us about what's happening at the brand, what's missing from the outdoor marketplace, and what outdoor brands need from a national trade show. That's up first today, but then stick around because we have a check in from the trail Wednesday.
Co host of the Rock Fight, Shantae Salibair, called me up yesterday to Check in and give an update that you're not going to want to miss.
Welcome back to the Rock fight, where today it's the last conversation we recorded at Goa Connect as Owen Comerford and I sit down with John Frederick from rab. All right, well, joining Owen and I today is John Frederick, the Group Marketing director of rab. Is that the title?
Jon Frederick
00:05:16.160 - 00:05:18.560
Title has actually just changed. Chief Marketing Officer.
Colin True
00:05:19.040 - 00:05:20.520
Whoa. Oh, wow.
Eoin Comerford
00:05:20.520 - 00:05:21.040
Okay.
Colin True
00:05:21.120 - 00:05:26.880
Yeah. All right. Okay, well, now we gotta change this whole thing because we were prepared for Group Marketing Director and.
Eoin Comerford
00:05:27.120 - 00:05:27.520
No.
Colin True
00:05:27.600 - 00:05:29.120
Welcome to the show, man. Thanks for being here.
Jon Frederick
00:05:29.120 - 00:05:30.560
Thank you. Thank you. Happy to be here.
Colin True
00:05:30.960 - 00:05:34.800
Are you. Did you come over right from. Are you still in England right now because you're moving back to the States?
Jon Frederick
00:05:34.800 - 00:05:41.420
Yeah, I mean, I still in England, landed on Saturday evening. So my. My brain is, like, in England and half in Reno right now.
Colin True
00:05:41.420 - 00:05:41.820
Right?
Jon Frederick
00:05:41.820 - 00:05:42.620
Yeah. Yeah. Going.
Colin True
00:05:42.620 - 00:05:44.260
Well, going west is easier than going east.
Jon Frederick
00:05:44.260 - 00:05:49.060
Way easier. Yeah. Because you take a nap on the plane, you land, you're tired, you go for a run, and you sleep it off. Yeah.
Colin True
00:05:49.060 - 00:05:58.460
I did ask going, because it's the first time you and I have met. It. Was it a. Is this going to be. Are you a Brit who came to the US Because I know you were in the US and are you going back to England?
So you're an American who went to England, now coming back to America.
Jon Frederick
00:05:58.460 - 00:05:59.980
Correct. There you go. That's it. Yeah.
Colin True
00:05:59.980 - 00:06:01.980
Are you aware of what's happening in America right now?
Jon Frederick
00:06:02.060 - 00:06:08.060
Yeah, yeah. People quite often ask, why are we moving back? But it's complicated. Yeah. I'm happy to be back.
Colin True
00:06:08.620 - 00:06:24.020
So let's start with explaining your new role. Right. So when it comes to RAB in the US you know, RAB operates as a subsidiary to rab, which is based in the uk. What's the structure of the brand?
Like, what's working? Not working with that structure when it comes to kind of growing rab in the U.S. like, how have you guys approached the U.S. marketplace?
Jon Frederick
00:06:24.020 - 00:07:53.830
Yeah, that's a great question.
I mean, so when we started and the way we launched in the US Which I think is actually pretty special to rab, and a bit of our secret sauce is our owner actually moved out here with his family, and he was like, it wasn't that, like, owner who was expecting to do the work for him. He was garment bags door to door, like, hey, check out this product we're making. And so he, like, personally launched the brand.
He hired the first reps, he opened the first office. So that was a real true investment into the Marketplace. And that was as a subsidiary.
And so we have subsidiaries in a handful of our core markets, so across Europe and US and Canada. And so that subsidiary model has worked really well for us now for quite a while.
And as far as a structure standpoint, for quite a while we sort of were run with like a bit of a general manager sort of setup.
And what we've changed really recently is really looking at sort of the operational strength of the business and saying, like, hey, we have this really strong, like sales structure for all our subsidiaries. Sales should be reporting into sales, marketing should be reporting to marketing. Like, let's work through our operational strengths.
And so that's really where we're set up now. So my move back, as you know we talked earlier, is really around, you know, sort of family health, with the amount of travel and all that that I do.
My role is still a global role.
So fortunate enough to be out in the uk, sit on the board there and really, from a strategic standpoint, look at, you know, how does this brand glow and maintain its relevance in the UK but also engage in markets like challenger markets like the US or Canada.
Eoin Comerford
00:07:54.470 - 00:08:13.520
So obviously Rab grew up as a UK brand, European brand. You've got to spend time in both markets and wear a bit of a global hat.
You know, maybe for a lot of our listeners here who are US based, what would maybe some of the key differences be between the European market and the US market?
Jon Frederick
00:08:14.240 - 00:08:58.140
Man, Key difference is it's almost like. I'd almost start with the similarity first, but, you know, like, is people like to buy local brands.
And I don't think as an American in the US we might not see it, but, you know, Americans like to buy strong American brands. You got your, you know, Patagonia, your North Face, your hardware, your. Or these are fantastic brands with a good history.
Same in Europe, you know, you have, in Norway, you have your neronas. In Germany, you have your Jack Wolf skin. In the uk you have your rabs and your mount equipments.
And so there is this like, real like commitment to these brands. The big difference in Europe is we don't have brands by every state there. They have brands by every country.
So there's this real like dominance of these sort of national brands in the European marketplace.
Eoin Comerford
00:08:58.780 - 00:09:30.580
Yeah, it's interesting because I deal with some, some brands here. They say, oh, we want to open in Europe. And my first question is, okay, which country? Because you don't just open in Europe.
It's just, you know, it's. It's like talking about just different Parts of the world, different climates, different customer bases, etc.
But now back on the US side, you really have succeeded here, I think, in the us where I would say a lot of other European brands that try to make the move about the same time, you know, that you guys did, which is probably what, 10, 15 years ago?
Jon Frederick
00:09:30.580 - 00:09:32.220
Yeah, about. Yeah, more like 14. Yes.
Eoin Comerford
00:09:32.220 - 00:09:49.080
Okay, so a lot of the brands, the Jack Wolfgangs you mentioned, the MIA's, the mountain equipment, some of those haven't really gotten that same footing. Was it just that the founder moved here or is there something else about RAB or the approach that helped you guys be successful?
Jon Frederick
00:09:49.160 - 00:11:38.030
Yeah, I'd say there's a few key points. One is for sure, the owner moving here could be summed up as commitment, I think. And so a.
That's like sort of practice what you preach a little bit by him doing it. But also then we have an office, we have our customer service here, we have our dealer services here, we warehouse here.
If you buy a product and it isn't perfect, we warranty it here, you don't have to ship it back to the uk.
And so that real commitment to the market, I think resonated with both, for sure, the retailers, because they felt that support, but also the customers. Yeah, because it starts to feel a little bit more familiar. And so that would be one. Another one for us is a unapologetic commitment to wholesale.
Like, we're firm believers in specialty retail. The way I would sort of describe it is like, how would you know how to put together your first trad rack?
How would you know what mondo size you were if we didn't have specialty retail? Like, we're all pretty screwed without specialty retail. And we think a lot of brands, unfortunately, have lost a bit of sight of that.
And so our commitment to that really gave us a good conversation piece with these retailers. And the way we sum it up is we don't compete with our retailers. So we're not discounting, we're not going off price, which is. It's not.
It's easier to say than do, but it's one of those things that really gives us staying power through retail relationships. And then I think the last but probably the most important thing comes down to product.
We call it sort of the RAB sweet spot, which is technical innovation, but at a price point that a dirt bag can still buy it. I think that's like the biggest frustration for me is you make a pinnacle piece, but the actual climber who wants it can't afford it.
And I think that's a real secret sauce to RAB is making these products that are winning awards, that are like, there's innovation in the tech, but a climber can go out and buy it and use it and beat it up and love it. So I think that sort of those three things combined is really what's done it for us.
Colin True
00:11:38.430 - 00:11:49.310
So we recently did our list of the top five apparel brands in the outdoor industry. I hope if you listened, you notice that I lobbied for RAB in the international category. I would like to point that out. Owen.
Eoin Comerford
00:11:49.550 - 00:11:52.390
I like them too. I said nice things.
Colin True
00:11:52.390 - 00:12:29.290
Just saying, just saying. I brought them up anyway.
But the one thing I noticed actually when we were recording that episode and it's kind of funny how simple this is, but also it kind of took working off a spreadsheet and seeing sort of the different categories and where we put the, where we kind of assigned the brands in the categories. You know, corn, outdoor, North American brands, you know, it's, it's a very steady list of these sort of main outdoor brands.
It has been for a long time.
So when you're, you know, season after season playing basically the market share game, like with Patagonia, the North Face, Marmot, outdoor research, hardware, et cetera, how do you strategize so that RAB gets placed and shows up in a way that consumers notice?
Jon Frederick
00:12:29.690 - 00:12:56.110
Yeah, it's tricky. It's so tricky. I think some of it is not.
If you're trying too hard to chase what other brands are doing, then you're always going to be behind because they're innovating further out. So we have fantastic supply chains, some fantastic factory end mill relationships.
So a lot of it for us is, yes, you have to be aware of what the market's doing because you can't try to innovate in an area that's oversaturated or cooling off.
Eoin Comerford
00:12:56.110 - 00:12:56.590
Yeah.
Jon Frederick
00:12:56.830 - 00:13:32.190
So I think industry, you know, awareness is a big piece of it. But then just really trying to innovate and saying like, how can we make that product lighter?
How can we, you know, add a feature set that will just make that product stand out? And feature sets is a big one for us.
Like we like making lightweight, minimalist products, but there's nothing worse than having a lightweight shell or puffy jacket where the hood flaps around in the wind so you can make things too light.
And so I think really understanding for, you know, how do we make a product that is built for purpose but also will stand out in that sea of similar sea sameness? Let's Be honest. There you go. Yeah.
Eoin Comerford
00:13:32.190 - 00:13:32.550
Yeah.
Colin True
00:13:33.110 - 00:13:35.070
Last time we had somebody from Radbon was Tim Fish.
Jon Frederick
00:13:35.070 - 00:13:35.630
Oh, yeah.
Eoin Comerford
00:13:35.630 - 00:13:36.070
Yeah.
Colin True
00:13:36.310 - 00:13:43.710
Which was a great conversation.
One of my favorite episodes, because it was definitely part of the idea behind this podcast is like, hey, I'm gonna have opinions, but please come prove me wrong.
Jon Frederick
00:13:43.710 - 00:13:44.230
Yeah.
Colin True
00:13:44.390 - 00:14:19.520
And I was curious. You know, I said some things about the mountain bike line, and he came on and made some great points about it. And also, it was really co.
I thought that he's like, hey, if we did it again from scratch, we'd buy. Do some things differently. It was a wonderful conversation.
But one thing we did talk about, too, was the ingredient label sort of initiative you guys have done, and which means a lot to me because I was at Timberland when they tried doing that in the early 2000s. How has that gone? I think you're probably two years into it now.
I mean, and I feel still it's so hard to get consumers like that consumer mindset shift.
I mean, even if they look at the label, I'm still thinking it's probably tough to kind of expect them to even understand what it means or what it does. But how would you say that has gone overall?
Jon Frederick
00:14:19.760 - 00:14:24.560
Yeah, no, that are material facts, that sort of labeling of what is in your product.
Colin True
00:14:25.200 - 00:14:26.800
Yeah, I should have explained that to the listener.
Jon Frederick
00:14:26.800 - 00:14:28.080
Yeah, no, I got your back.
Colin True
00:14:28.080 - 00:14:28.720
Thanks, buddy.
Jon Frederick
00:14:28.720 - 00:14:41.120
Yeah. But no, that it's going really well.
I think there's a challenge there, and you hit the nail on the head with the consumer piece is you're fooling yourself if you think they're just going to thank you for doing something like this. You know, the transparency.
Colin True
00:14:41.200 - 00:14:42.720
I shall buy your garment now.
Jon Frederick
00:14:43.120 - 00:14:52.920
Exactly, exactly.
And we all are told that, you know, the younger demographics, they're, you know, so prioritizing sustainability is one of the top reasons for purchase, but it still isn't. We're not feeling that.
Colin True
00:14:52.920 - 00:14:53.240
Yeah.
Jon Frederick
00:14:53.240 - 00:14:53.560
That means they're.
Colin True
00:14:53.560 - 00:14:54.800
By buying secondhand, right?
Jon Frederick
00:14:54.800 - 00:16:00.920
Yeah, totally. And that's where you're seeing vintage come out and things like that. But no, overall. So the labels are.
We're receiving really, really positive feedback, specifically in the European market, where there's legislation forcing a lot of the decision making in that area. Right. But another thing that's. We've.
We're sort of moving, not moving on because we're still doing Material Facts, but we've launched this thing called Material Facts Collective, which is actually working with a collective of brands, a number that are here at Goa. And it's about the sort of the principles and the formulas behind Material Facts.
It's not saying that everyone's going to put the Material Facts label on their products or on their websites, but it's saying here's the hours and weeks and months of effort we put into learning how to calculate this data and learn about this.
And so this Material Facts Collective which we're sort of continuing to like build and progress and we're going to be sort of launching the names of the brands we're working with is really exciting for us because I think it's. We've always said that for this to work it needs to become a bit of an industry standard like totally.
And we do feel like we're gaining some traction there and the industry believing really and sort of agreeing on how do you capture this data? What's the right or wrong way to do it.
Colin True
00:16:00.920 - 00:16:19.320
I wonder if there's a outside of the industry standard that should be pursued to like, it'd be interesting if you partnered with like a skims or some, some of the big who really desperately needs it. But they also, you know what I mean?
Like the somebody was with a lot of like presence outside of the industry and like, hey, we're going to do this to now would that move the needle? You know?
Jon Frederick
00:16:19.320 - 00:17:03.980
Yeah, I think it, I think anything outside of, you know, the industry can be so insular and I think anything outside of that can help. And I think for us an eye opening piece.
There was, we were really talking to outdoor brands, outdoor industry and it was really when the snow sports industry and Sia actually heard myself and Debbie, who's our head of sustainability, we were talking about Material Facts Collective at the EOG summit.
They happen to be there and they came up and they're like, we want to know more like would you all please come to Sun Valley and tell our members about this. So Tim actually went out to Sun Valley and talked about the collective there. So the snow sports industry has really welcomed us.
Not the outside outdoor industry didn't, but it just. Yeah. So I think maybe even moving further, you know, out could be really good.
Colin True
00:17:04.060 - 00:17:07.500
Was it hard to, you know, twist Tim's arm or say do you want to go to Sun Valley for.
Jon Frederick
00:17:07.820 - 00:17:19.960
Yeah, it was a real rough winter. Yeah, yeah, it was. The snow was not good. No, perfect for him. It was. No, it was sunny, blue sky, perfect conditions. It was good, good, good work trip.
Eoin Comerford
00:17:20.680 - 00:18:01.620
Back at Moose Jaw we were, I think one of the earlier retailers to take on, to take on Rabbit and you know, I did always love the brand Colin. Okay.
And you know, to your point, you Know, meeting the founder and really getting the sense of that brand was, was important with that and the sales. Sales really back that up. One of the things that I feel like I noticed is that when people discover Rab, they actually become pretty loyal.
More so than maybe we saw with other. Some of the other big brands that we mentioned. Why, why do you think that? Is that true? Am I just making that up or if so, why is it true?
Jon Frederick
00:18:02.020 - 00:18:41.550
Yeah, I actually have, like, a very timely comment on that is I was talking with our Southwest rep who lives in the area, and he was. We were just randomly talking about a guide. He ran into working, who's like head to toe Rab.
And he went up to the guide and he was like, are you, are you working with Rab? And he's like, no, I used to work for X brand. I don't anymore. And he's like, I bought one per app piece. I loved how it fit.
I love how sort of purpose built it was. So I bought another, then I bought another, and now it's like my wardrobe. And I think that is because it is really purpose built.
It is built to do something. And I think that's why an active user, usually when they get that first beat, if the fit's there, then they're. They're sold. Yeah, yeah.
Eoin Comerford
00:18:41.550 - 00:18:43.110
Fit is so important. Absolutely.
Jon Frederick
00:18:43.190 - 00:19:02.230
And fit's not universal. I think that's the other thing is, you know, when someone's like, oh man, that jacket just fit like shit.
It's like, I don't take it personal because I try on a lot of jackets that don't fit well. And I don't insult the brand because of it, because we need different fits. There's a lot of different body types out there.
But I do think again, for that active user, our fit has really landed well in the us.
Eoin Comerford
00:19:02.470 - 00:19:13.900
Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think sometimes some of, some of those, maybe old school brands tend to lean more towards the boxy fish.
And then sometimes with some of the European brands, it's the other extreme.
Colin True
00:19:13.900 - 00:19:14.140
Right.
Eoin Comerford
00:19:14.140 - 00:19:18.540
And so if you can be a little bit in the Goldilocks zone, that can really, really work for you.
Jon Frederick
00:19:18.540 - 00:19:33.730
Yeah. And that has been our goal really, is like you, it's dangerous to become €2 because the market's definitely not here for that.
But yeah, American brands can be guilty of. You hit the nail on the head, that boxy fit. And I do think we have, I think we actually have a really progressive fit for that active user.
Colin True
00:19:34.440 - 00:19:44.440
So where, where are the soft points? Like, what's missing?
Like you know, the name the brands that aren't really innovating anymore that probably wouldn't be appropriate, but, you know, there's not. What are the. Where are the opportunities for rab?
Jon Frederick
00:19:45.320 - 00:20:35.380
Yeah, I mean, I think the opportunities. Yeah, I'm not going to name brands, but I think really it is so tempting though. It is, it's always tempting.
No, I actually, you know, one thing we say all the time and with retailers and I, I'm not, I'm not ever here to make friends. I mean, I think I love making friends because this is an industry of amazing people.
But I can very safely say there's so many amazing brands in this room. Like there really are. Like, we're lucky. Like, it's not about trying to.
We're growing by trying to crush other brands because there's so many amazing brands doing awesome things. I think we're fortunate that we sort of carved our niche. Our niche, you know, of products that do innovate around or in some gaps there.
So as far as opportunity, you know, this whole, this industry is so soft. Like the US market is so soft.
Like anytime I take photos from these trade shows and show it to our, our UK design team, they're always, it's just a little bit of a, you know, whether it's prints or the fabrics.
Colin True
00:20:35.380 - 00:20:37.640
Or soft meaning, like a lot of sweaters.
Jon Frederick
00:20:37.640 - 00:21:18.510
I don't mean soft tactile, I just mean like how. Like, like it's less technical, you know, less technical. Right.
And so for us, I think we do have, we're trying to innovate in that space of how do you make. Call it athleisure, you know, how do you make a non offensive athleisure collection in a true rab way that is a piece that you'd, yeah.
Be comfortable wearing, you know, whether you're in college or to the, you know, the brewery. But also you can climb in it, you could guide in it. And I think that's an area where we're putting some focus.
It's something we shied away from the past because we don't want to. Like we are a brand for the mountain people. We don't want to, you know, like hurt that by trying to change who we are.
But we are being honest with ourselves that a lot of mountain people don't want to look like a mountaineer, you know, all the time.
Eoin Comerford
00:21:18.510 - 00:21:24.990
So he. So you heard that Rob is saying that basically the US is soft. We're woos's. Basically.
Jon Frederick
00:21:25.630 - 00:21:35.860
I do have to call out that it's rab not Rob. I gotta go there. It's Rabbit. Yeah, yeah. So it's Rab Carrington. So our founder was Rab Carrington. So he was a Scott. Yeah.
Eoin Comerford
00:21:35.860 - 00:21:37.180
Is Rab short for something?
Jon Frederick
00:21:37.420 - 00:21:49.020
Yeah. So Rab. So it's Scottish. And it's. It would not be fair to Rab to say it's short for Robert. But that, that, that can be a thing. But he's rap. He's a.
He's a. He's. He's a Rab always been a rap.
Colin True
00:21:49.020 - 00:21:50.780
So it's not Matt Gower. Okay.
Jon Frederick
00:21:50.860 - 00:21:57.020
So Matt Gower purchased the brand from rap. But that's an awesome thing. So we have this, like, lineage that goes straight through. Yeah.
Colin True
00:21:57.020 - 00:22:00.250
So we're so basically found her left. Because it's still in one. One vision.
Jon Frederick
00:22:00.250 - 00:22:13.410
Oh, fantastic. Yeah, for sure. And then, you know, because Rab really, what he innovated was around the insulation, like making this amazing insulation.
What Matt has brought to the businesses, everything else, as well as continuing to innovate on that installation side of things.
Colin True
00:22:13.490 - 00:22:20.930
We need to like, go back in time, have like a Rab versus Royal, like, you know, throw down, you know, see who would win the. The Mountaineer apparel brand guy.
Jon Frederick
00:22:20.930 - 00:22:26.930
Yeah. Rab's still climbing pretty hard. Okay, there you go. He wins by longevity.
Colin True
00:22:28.970 - 00:22:41.130
So we're recording this at GA Connect. This will come out a couple weeks, probably after that event. But, you know, looking at kind of where we are, how do you view the current industry?
You know, trade show and event scene? You know, is it. Is this kind of stuff important to the brand?
Jon Frederick
00:22:41.450 - 00:24:05.780
I mean, we love Goa. Goa is so critical to the brand. I think it's. It's a.
It's a really strong voice for specialty retail, I think, you know, but at the end of the day, because it's a. It's a group, it's a voice for those specialty retailers. I think, you know, that's a big question you just asked.
Because I think that the trade show world is complicated right now. Fractured. I think what I could really confidently say, and I think what.
I'll just jump right into what we're missing, you know, because I think G Way is fantastic. We love it. We would be lost without it. Like, I mean, it's such a huge part of our.
Our sort of family out here, but is a bigger meeting that can be a voice for the industry. And I think I was actually talking to. That came from Nemo about this.
And my analogy was, you know, the best sort of battle place tactics is to divide. If you can divide up and you can fight a bunch of small battles, you're more likely to win.
And I feel like no one's intentionally doing that to this industry. But that's what's happening is because we don't have this big collective. And it doesn't have to be an or it doesn't have to be.
I'm not putting a name to what it is.
But if you're talking about policy and public lands, if you're talking about, you know, our conversation around inventory planning and buy dates and lead times, pick a topic. We're not able to have a real strong forum and this sort of power by numbers as an industry. So I think, like, what do we need?
We need the industry to be able to have that voice again. And I feel like we're just a little too fractured right now.
Colin True
00:24:06.260 - 00:24:07.940
So you are going to switchback next week?
Jon Frederick
00:24:07.940 - 00:24:09.340
I'm going to switch back next week.
Colin True
00:24:09.340 - 00:24:15.380
I said this will probably come out after that. What are you anticipating to that coming off the heels of what you just said about, you know, what the industry needs?
Jon Frederick
00:24:15.380 - 00:25:08.020
Yeah, I mean, so I'm going to switch back because I want to see, like, I think we have invested heavily into trade. We believe in trade shows. We've believed a little. We've probably invested a little too long in some trade shows past their expiration date.
But no, really curious to see what's happening with switchback. We're excited to see the brand commitment. I think I'm hoping to see sort of some retail energy there as well.
But if we don't see that, then I think the onus is on the brands to really say, how do we really commit in a way that the retailers will believe? And I do think Goa did something absolutely fantastic the day before the show where there was a bit of a leadership summit with a handful of brands.
And this was a conversation we talked quite a bit about is like, how do you. How do these brands not just have one off conversations off the scenes, but how do we have a public conversation about this?
So it's a white to the ice. Like, we're all going. You need to go. Let's do this together.
Colin True
00:25:08.420 - 00:25:10.580
All right, man. Well, appreciate you spending a few minutes with us.
Jon Frederick
00:25:10.820 - 00:25:12.300
Yeah, thanks for having me. This is great.
Colin True
00:25:12.300 - 00:25:18.700
Great. Thank you so much. Let's keep in touch. And, you know, I don't know, next time we do the apparel list, I'll get you back again. Don't worry.
Jon Frederick
00:25:18.700 - 00:25:19.140
Yeah, I can.
Colin True
00:25:19.140 - 00:25:20.180
I won't let Owen keep you down.
Jon Frederick
00:25:20.180 - 00:25:29.040
I think you can win. You win. You guys over a little bit more. I'm in some bribes. I hear there's a really good tequila spot around the corner.
Eoin Comerford
00:25:29.840 - 00:25:32.400
Colin can be bought. We know this.
Colin True
00:25:35.360 - 00:25:36.080
Thanks Jon.
Jon Frederick
00:25:36.080 - 00:25:36.720
Yeah, thanks.
Colin True
00:25:38.479 - 00:27:51.350
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Chris DeMakes
00:27:51.510 - 00:28:00.550
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Colin True
00:28:03.830 - 00:28:44.150
All right, so regular listeners of the Rock Flight know that our Wednesday co host Shantae Salibare. She is out on the JMT right now because she's finishing up a guidebook.
And so she's spending three weeks out there collecting information for that guidebook. That's really all I know about that. She's been very pretty secretive about what exactly is going on with that book.
But she had the opportunity to give me a call during the time she was taking a zero day and we recorded the conversation. So we get an update from her as well as talk about my new revelation that I don't think I really like hiking anymore.
So let's get into my conversation with Shantae and then we'll turn her loose. Back on the trail, where are you?
Shawnté Salabert
00:28:44.630 - 00:29:35.300
I'm at Vermilion Valley Resort. VVR to the PCT and JMT faithful and people from Fresno who like to come up here on the weekends.
It is a rustic backcountry resort, and I'm using the word resort only because they call it that. I would say it's a little bit more like an 80s movie Summer Camp combined with a dude ranch that doesn't have horses. It's a very.
It's a place you come to have a little R and R. You have to take a ferry or walk five extra miles off trail, which we would call bonus miles in hiker speak. But you get here and they've got free camping or you can rent some lodging. You can mail yourself a resupply box or buy from their little store.
They have a really good restaurant. They've got cornhole, campfire, there's a lake. It's pretty great.
Colin True
00:29:35.700 - 00:29:40.980
Explaining bonus miles by calling that hiker speak. Is that the most pretentious thing you've ever said in your entire life?
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:41.460 - 00:29:44.140
Yeah, probably. Probably. Yeah.
Colin True
00:29:44.140 - 00:29:51.020
Also, by the way, I like that you're totally repping the gear Abbey cover art right now with the braids and the hat.
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:51.020 - 00:29:56.500
My braids in my hat. This is. And I'm wearing loner clothes because my clothes are in the laundry right now, so.
Colin True
00:29:56.500 - 00:29:57.050
Oh, right on.
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:57.840 - 00:30:10.000
Yeah. This is really me at my absolute best. I'm probably very sunburnt and gross looking, so enjoy. This is Shantae.
This is my trail name is actually rustic, so this is me at my most rustic.
Colin True
00:30:10.240 - 00:30:12.080
Wow. I didn't know that. I didn't know that was your trail name.
Shawnté Salabert
00:30:12.400 - 00:30:23.690
Yeah, it is also Peep this hat, land of outsiders that I got when I was at the State Outdoor Business Alliance Breakfast at side. I was gonna say it sidetracked at Switchback.
Colin True
00:30:24.480 - 00:30:26.720
Oh, no way. That's A switchback swag piece right there.
Shawnté Salabert
00:30:26.880 - 00:30:36.680
It is. It is. I was sitting there with Owen, and he had one. I was like, that's a great hat. And you know what? They gave me one, which is perfect.
Cause I needed a hat for the trail, so.
Colin True
00:30:36.680 - 00:30:46.000
God, I'm trying to picture Owen wearing that hat. That would be amazing. We need to see that, actually. Owen should always wear a turtle from now on. Yes, I agree. I agree. Well, how are you feeling?
Are you good?
Shawnté Salabert
00:30:46.560 - 00:30:56.300
I'm good. I'm eight days in, and I ate a salad last night, which was deeply inspiring to me after eating so much.
Colin True
00:30:56.540 - 00:31:00.380
First poo reference. Incoming in 3, 2, 1.
Shawnté Salabert
00:31:00.460 - 00:31:37.030
No, look, I am honor honoring my commitment to Owen to be a lady out here. Okay? This is lady Rustic, Lady Shantae. No, I'm feeling pretty good. I'm a little beat up.
I noticed yesterday when I took a shower that I have chafing on my lower back, which I could feel because it's really hot out here. And I have. Since I'm out here working on a book, I've got a ton of extra equipment with me, which is a real pain in the ass.
But my pack is heavier than normal, so I've got chafing on my back, chafing on both my hips, and a new one for me, chafing on my rib cage. Oh, yeah.
Colin True
00:31:37.910 - 00:31:44.630
Is there new gear involved? Is it just sort of, for whatever reason, not, you know, quite the same fit? Different. Different in the way you have it packed?
What do you think that is?
Shawnté Salabert
00:31:44.950 - 00:31:54.010
It's because my backpack, which had ripped, got sent to the manufacturer, who promised to repair it, and then they never responded to any of my requests to return my backpack.
Colin True
00:31:54.010 - 00:31:55.730
Would we like to call them out right now?
Shawnté Salabert
00:31:56.210 - 00:31:59.570
I don't. They're a real small brand, and I know they're doing the best they can.
Colin True
00:31:59.890 - 00:32:00.250
Okay.
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:00.250 - 00:32:18.630
Okay. It's such a bummer, because then I had to, like, last minute, seriously, with days to go, switch to an old pack that just doesn't fit very well.
So hence, here we are. And of course, you know what just came in the mail yesterday? Apparently a whole kit from gossamer gear at your home. At my home. Yep. Yep.
Colin True
00:32:18.630 - 00:32:21.470
Is there any way you can get that, like, shuttled up to your next resupply?
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:21.630 - 00:32:24.110
It's not worth it. It's okay. Next trip. Next trip.
Colin True
00:32:24.110 - 00:32:28.030
All right, so how do you plan on handling the chafing when you put your pack back on tomorrow?
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:28.670 - 00:32:42.430
I have done a lot of chafing mitigation. I mean, I do have body Glide with me.
But what I'm probably going to do is I've been applying Aquaphor very liberally and then I'm going to probably just apply some KT tape, so.
Colin True
00:32:42.830 - 00:32:43.710
Oh, that's a good idea.
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:43.710 - 00:32:44.030
Yeah.
Colin True
00:32:44.030 - 00:32:47.370
It takes something like putting some adhesive on top of raw and wounds.
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:47.690 - 00:32:50.970
I want to make it worse. What I want to do, you make.
Colin True
00:32:50.970 - 00:32:53.090
Sure you videotape you ripping it off. Like look at.
Chris DeMakes
00:32:53.090 - 00:32:53.690
Oh God.
Shawnté Salabert
00:32:54.010 - 00:32:59.050
That'll be the only fans content for the weirdos that I can send pictures of my feet right now.
Colin True
00:32:59.130 - 00:33:00.410
There are people out there.
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:00.650 - 00:33:04.490
Yeah, listen, I could use some extra cash. It's not cheap staying at vbr.
Colin True
00:33:04.570 - 00:33:06.650
Well, and it's really not like demeaning to you.
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:06.650 - 00:33:16.730
I mean, you know, hey, the feet are dirty. If you are into this, come and get some of it. I can give you my Venmo at Shantae Dash Salibair. Send me some money. Maybe you get.
Colin True
00:33:16.730 - 00:33:21.830
You mean to bleep that out? Because otherwise you're going to owe people some photos if all of a sudden money starts showing up in your Venmo while you're hiking.
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:22.070 - 00:33:28.870
I don't know where that money came from. It's a mystery to me. Maybe some people just want to sponsor, you know, a cold beverage for me on the hike.
Colin True
00:33:29.670 - 00:33:30.630
That's a good idea.
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:30.710 - 00:33:31.510
I know, right?
Colin True
00:33:31.670 - 00:33:35.670
All right. So are you eight days in. I hiked Baldi the other day.
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:36.150 - 00:33:36.950
How did it go?
Colin True
00:33:37.190 - 00:34:17.310
It went. It went great. To the people who out there, who maybe you know, it's a 10,000, they don't know bald is about a 10,000 foot peak.
It is a 10,000 foot peak here in Southern California, which I think automatically disqualifies it from the Colorado conversation because it's not over 14 and it's near LA, so. But you know, it's not a real mountain. It's not a real mountain. Great, great hike. Beautiful. All the things lived up to the expectations.
But I think I realized I just don't like hiking anymore. So I was actually thinking of you. I'm like, as I was finishing up, I'm like, I am.
My bucket is filled for like the next decade on big, like on big, like mountain hikes. Like I'm good on like a nice little short. I think beginner hikes are actually the best hikes. More reflect on it. So how are you feeling?
Getting up every day thinking, oh good, I get to hike more.
Shawnté Salabert
00:34:18.420 - 00:35:12.430
Well, it's funny, yesterday I took the ferry into vvr. You take a ferry from the far side of Lake Edison for 20 bucks. Totally worth it.
And there were some folks on there, and one of them asked me, like, all right, you do this a lot. How do you deal with, like, the low points? And I said, you're gonna. On a long hike, you're gonna have low points every day.
Like, even if it's just a few minutes. Some days it's half a day. Some days it's a whole day. There's a saying in. In hiking where you don't quit on a bad day.
But for me, it's remembering that I'm not rushing every day to a destination, even though maybe I'm heading to a lake or a place I'm excited about to try to make it an active walking meditation. Yes. I'm out here working, which is probably hard for a lot of people to comprehend.
It's actually really mentally exhausting because I have to pay attention to everything. I'm taking photos. I've got two GPS devices on me.
Colin True
00:35:12.990 - 00:35:14.110
You're not just hiking?
Shawnté Salabert
00:35:14.110 - 00:36:09.590
Yeah, I'm not just hiking. Unfortunately, I kind of have to be here. But the way I make it work for me is I try to stay in the moment as much as possible.
I actually just finished Katie Arnold's newer book that she actually talked with Doug on Open Container, about, Brief Flashings in the Phenomenal World, which is about running and Zen and a boat accident. None of those things. And all of those things.
But it was the perfect book to read out here for my first book of what will probably be several, because she talks about realizing at some points she was just metaphorically going against the river. And I was like, oh, man. I feel that sometimes, like, I'm just trying to grind out the miles or I'm trying to get to this place.
And what happens if you drop that and you just stay really present? You're in the moment. I see flowers I might not have seen. I hear birdsong. I see all of the beautiful marmots that still won't let me hug them, sadly.
Colin True
00:36:10.470 - 00:36:11.590
Have you asked all of them?
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:11.830 - 00:36:18.710
I try. I mean, I have definitely said things like, oh, I wish I could just touch your little haunches. But they're not into, it turns out.
Colin True
00:36:19.860 - 00:36:24.500
And for more onlyfans content, seek out Shantae on. Touch your little haunches.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:24.500 - 00:37:43.440
Oh, my God. This is how I get arrested. Wow.
But, yeah, I think for me, it's thinking about being here as an active Zen, because it's just like meditation where you acknowledge the thoughts that come into your head. They may be good, they may be bad, they May be I am over it. And you let them go by and you keep moving. And it really is.
When you have a goal in mind, it's one foot in front of the other, quite literally out here, one mile after the other. I take a lot of breaks. I eat. I actually do. I've adopted sort of a trail running mentality. Cause you know, I trail run too. Yeah, I do.
Fueling every 30 minutes out here, just like I would if I was trail running on a longer trail. So that also helps with morale. It helps with energy. Yeah.
I mean, I still, I've hiked this trail four times now and I can still find new things to appreciate, which is really delightful. But that's because maybe the trail is the same and even it's actually not because you've got avalanches, you've got water that changes the trail.
Trees fall down and change the trail. Yeah, but you are different every time you step on the trail. So that's something I like to think about too.
It's a little more existential for me sometimes. So. I still love hiking. I don't know that I'm going to want to be doing a couple hundred miles again every time. I'm a little tired.
Colin True
00:37:43.440 - 00:38:11.520
But yeah, I mean, I'm obviously being a little like, you know, over the top. I just, I had a kind of thinking like, oh, I get back into like peak bagging on this hike. Like, this is kind of fun.
Maybe we'll start looking at different lists. And by the end of it, and I don't. And it was a fine hike. I felt great.
It wasn't like I was like, got hurt or something happened or I'm like, oh, screw this. No, just by the end, I'm like, yeah, I don't think I need to do this again for a while. And I thought of you.
I'm like, oh my God, if I were Shantae, I'd have to wake up tomorrow and do it again. And I'm like, I don't think I want to do that. I think I would. Like, I was going to go for like an hour long bike ride and call it. Good, good.
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:11.520 - 00:38:26.800
So listen, that's going to be my life after this. I'm. I'm definitely adopting your mindset after this. I can already tell. I'm like, when I get back, I. I think I texted my boss the other day.
I have a day job. And I texted him. I was like, dude, I think I need to rethink my vacations after this.
Colin True
00:38:26.800 - 00:38:30.080
That's right. You know what's pretty sweet is a beach in Mexico.
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:30.160 - 00:38:36.880
You know how people maintain horizontal status for a lot of their vacations? I should try that. I think that could be fun for me.
Jon Frederick
00:38:37.120 - 00:38:37.680
I do.
Colin True
00:38:37.760 - 00:38:50.780
That was my second thought after this other realization, like, oh, this is the sign that I am indeed turning 50 this year. And like. Like the 30s and 40s were like, I have goals, and I gotta go achieve them. And I'm like, you know, I think I've done a lot.
I think I'm all right over here, you know?
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:51.100 - 00:39:18.510
Yeah. It's amazing. I think about this. When you look at outdoor adventure in particular. I think there's a lot of folks.
Katie actually talks about this a little bit in her book, because I think she's just a hair older than you. But it's that idea of, what are these? Like, do we still have that drive and why and what are we trying to prove? And I think about that a lot.
You know, I don't want as much type 2 fun, to quote Brendan Leonard in my life as I used to.
Colin True
00:39:18.830 - 00:39:19.230
Same.
Shawnté Salabert
00:39:19.390 - 00:39:45.740
Yeah. It's like, little hits of it are great. This will stay with me. This is a deeper experience for me.
But I think about athletes that continue just really going at it as they get into their late 40s and their 50s and even older in some cases, and mad props to them. But do you. What's actually motivating you at that point? Is it still.
I try to separate ego out a lot because I do think ego, whether we want to acknowledge it or not, drives a lot of what we do.
Colin True
00:39:46.060 - 00:39:47.180
100% does.
Shawnté Salabert
00:39:47.580 - 00:40:34.210
Yeah. Whether we think we're, like, the most humble person on earth, there's still some aspect of it that's like, I got to do this.
So, you know, it's funny. I actually changed my mindset coming into this hike.
I was like, all right, I'm going to hike everything in order, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and just stick to the trail. And I realized I'm like, you know what? You've done this a bunch.
What's more useful for me and as a book author and also as a human being, is taking some of the side quests, going up to some lake basins, doing some things I haven't done before.
So I'm leaning into that and still having that joy of discovery, but not feeling like I have to tick certain boxes so that other people go, oh, wow, look at her. It's just not that important to me.
Nobody's actually looking at me that way anyway, so they're like, who's this Middle aged woman on the trail, you weirdo.
Colin True
00:40:35.020 - 00:41:34.370
Right? Yeah. I think that's kind of what it's come to for me too.
Like those little sort of inconveniences that you didn't mind before now just getting like how much more do I really want to do this? And, and the cool thing too I think about, I mentioned like the beginner hikes.
There's so many good beginner hikes where you kind of got to check all the.
Especially like in Eastern Sierra and stuff like that where it's like, hey, it's like a mile and a half hike around this lake with these soaring peaks in the background. You still get the beauty and the nature of the stuff that you kind of.
And I get to bring it back to a common theme that we talk about here on the rock fight of you know, the casuals versus the hardcore.
And it's like, you know, these sort of expansion of the casual world has really enabled you to have some incredible like, you know, bucket filling sort of experiences without the just like decimating your bodies over the course of a long day sort of, you know, you know, physical aspect of it too. And I got. That was just, it was, I was surprised. I really was like thought this is going to.
Okay, phase two of Colin the Peak Bagger might start today. Heading up Baldy.
And by the time I was heading down the Devil's Backbone trail which was glorious and amazing and I explained multiple times to my daughter and her boyfriend like, oh my God, look at this view. This is awesome.
Eoin Comerford
00:41:34.530 - 00:41:34.850
Then.
Colin True
00:41:34.850 - 00:41:44.130
But by the time we got to the lodge and I was ordering a beer and I'm like, yeah, I'm all right for a little while. I don't. Okay. Altitude sucks. I can't breathe. Let's go home.
Shawnté Salabert
00:41:46.050 - 00:41:56.290
Yeah, it's so true. I mean it is, it is fun being out here. I will say like part of doing a longer hike like this is you meet people.
Although I'll say it's been very quiet. I've been alone most of the time out here.
Colin True
00:41:56.370 - 00:41:56.930
Wow.
Shawnté Salabert
00:41:56.930 - 00:43:04.130
Yeah, it's very strange. There's a, there is a flow.
We've got like the back edge of the PCT bubble that has just passed through but it has been very quiet and most nights I, I've been camped by myself even at popular places.
But I did, I have had a few fun run ins and one of the things I think still unites people and this you could talk about the casual user and the hardcore enthusiast is gear people. People love gear. Whether you are a day hiker or you are out here doing 2,650 miles on the PCT.
I had a funny experience a couple days ago heading south from Red's Meadow. These two hikers who turned out to be Japanese, which I found out because I thought they were spe Japanese.
And they started talking to me and just pointing at my gear and just line listing the brands. They're like, oh, Six Moon Designs. Oh, Thru Pack. Oh, Canuck. Like, it was absolutely hilarious.
And I made the mistake of asking in Japanese if they were speaking. If they spoke Japanese. And they were so excited. I was like, oh, shit. All of my Japanese just left my head. So then we had to.
I had to talk like, are you.
Colin True
00:43:04.130 - 00:43:05.850
Humble bragging that you speak Japanese right now?
Shawnté Salabert
00:43:06.010 - 00:44:03.530
I'm not. What I'm humble bragging is that I have a great neck for forgetting languages.
I thought I knew in the moment when they're most useful, but, yeah, just seeing, like, the delight. They're pointing to all Ridge. I had a ridge merino hoodie on. And the guys, that was the first thing they saw that has.
There's a little emblem on the sleeve. And the guy just points it, he goes, oh, Ridge Marino, did you get that in Mammoth? And I was like, oh, no, I've had it.
But you can get them in Mammoth. And they were so stoked.
They're like, I'm gonna get it sitting here at vvr, a woman walked up to me this morning and I'm all huddled up in my Alpha direct fleece from Sam Bob, which is a small cottage manufacturer. It's this guy, Sam Roberts. Hence Sam Bob. Anyway, I'm wearing this fleece and this woman walks up, she's like, I've been looking at you. Wear it.
What is that? And how can I get it? And I showed her the tag. I was like, he's doing a sale today. In fact, it's just a dude making fleeces.
Like, go buy yourself a fleece if that's what makes you happy. But it's like, that is the brands.
Colin True
00:44:03.530 - 00:45:02.150
And the products of our. I've said it a million times, are the celebrities of the outdoors. People love the stuff. It was fun.
That was actually a fun thing, being on ball Baldi, which is a, you know, relatively like, you know, it's an intense day hike. I mean, you're at elevation. You are. You were deep in the mountains. And so even though it's incredibly popular, and it was.
It was the 4th of July and there were a ton of people up there, but you can't take it for granted that you're just going to cruise up there and a pair of beat up, like, you know, Chuck. Chuck Taylors and holding a bottle of, like spring water and you're going to make it through.
You have to be prepared for this hike or you won't make it through.
And so I was just taking inventory and we're definitely going to talk about this in some future episodes of the Ride Rock Fight of, you know, what people were wearing and why. And some conversations we had met running two guys who run ultras and what were they wearing?
And I had my nordis on and they had never heard of nordas. And these are guys who are actively running ultras. So it kind of shows you, like, hey, this Guy's gonna run 100 milers.
He's not even familiar with this brand that is, you know, supposed to be this ascendant brand in the space. It's just, it's, it's always fascinating, for sure.
Shawnté Salabert
00:45:02.470 - 00:45:06.870
Yeah, it is. It is the great unifier, I think, the outdoors itself and the gear we use to.
Colin True
00:45:06.870 - 00:45:13.580
And the gear we use. And as Rachel Gross said, you know, in the United States, going outside starts at the gear shop.
Shawnté Salabert
00:45:13.820 - 00:45:20.700
It really does. I mean, it's, it's, it's a fun thing, you know. Yeah, we can say, oh, this is all materialism and commercial, you know, capital.
Colin True
00:45:20.700 - 00:45:21.860
They're intertwined, man.
Shawnté Salabert
00:45:21.860 - 00:46:36.590
It's all intertwined. We live in America. But I.
But seeing the connections you can make with people in such a short time span are honestly, it always just, it's delightful because they, they can lead to bigger conversations. I've already gotten several people's contact information out here that want to stay in touch. And it might start with a goofy conversation.
Like, last summer, I met a woman here at vvr. She goes by the Hungry. Hiker is her social handle. She's got a prolific following. She loves to eat, as it turns out, and hike. Kathleen Nevis.
And she was sitting here. There's an outdoor patio where all of the stinky, dirtbag hikers hang out while the weekend visitors go inside.
And she was sitting there in a dress, a hiking dress made by a very small company called Purple Rain Gear. And it is not owned by Prince, I'm sorry to tell you. Sorry.
But I saw her dress and being a nerdy hiker person, I was like, is that a purple reindeer dress in purple? I didn't know they made them. We talked for a half hour just at each other.
And then she touched my shoulder and she stopped and she said, so we're going to be friends for life, right? And I said, yep. And you better bet. I saw her this Christmas time. We were just talking about getting together. It all starts.
Colin True
00:46:36.590 - 00:46:42.990
So when you turn up murdered, that's who I'm going to go see first because like make sure that we establish that connection.
Shawnté Salabert
00:46:43.310 - 00:46:45.470
She is a kind person who makes good food.
Colin True
00:46:46.190 - 00:46:52.850
No, I rock Fight. Just followed her on Instagram. Hopefully she follows us back. Oh wait, I had a follow up question.
Shawnté Salabert
00:46:53.880 - 00:46:58.040
You want to ask me if anybody's been touching bison out here? Any good? Any good outdoor headlines?
Colin True
00:46:58.040 - 00:47:12.520
Well, right, that's a good point. Let's get into some of the things that we talk about on the show. What's going on. Like have you.
Have you run into any wildlife encounters, you're sleeping by yourself, Any. Any near death experiences? And you do.
Despite what you said earlier, I do know there's a story that Mr. Owen Comerford needs to hear from your first day on the trail, but.
Shawnté Salabert
00:47:13.560 - 00:47:16.920
Okay, I'll tell you, this is so I thought we were going to get away with not. Actually.
Colin True
00:47:17.480 - 00:47:18.200
No, no, no.
Shawnté Salabert
00:47:19.400 - 00:47:54.760
All right. To our faithful listeners. You know it's coming. It is a story about the second morning.
In fact, I was doing a very beautiful yogi squat taking care of business and I sort of my body shifted for a second and reaggravated a like 14 year old car accident injury. And I had for days a pulled muscle from the back of my head all the way down my neck to my shoulder.
I named him after an ex boyfriend, so we won't say his name on the podcast, but someone who also was a painist. The neck. Yeah, but that was.
Colin True
00:47:54.920 - 00:47:59.320
Wait, wait, what does the exploit have to do with you get pulling a muscle while literally taking a dump?
Shawnté Salabert
00:47:59.640 - 00:48:00.600
It was so angry.
Colin True
00:48:01.080 - 00:48:03.160
Oh, you named the muscle after an exploitation?
Shawnté Salabert
00:48:03.720 - 00:48:08.200
Because it was every step I was in pain, so made me think of him.
Colin True
00:48:08.200 - 00:48:12.120
Yeah, well, hopefully you're pooping pain free now.
Shawnté Salabert
00:48:12.360 - 00:48:18.040
I am. Well, I wasn't. I just have to say I wasn't pushing or anything. Okay. This was the case.
Colin True
00:48:18.840 - 00:48:21.750
We were fine. It just there. This is where we lost Owen.
Shawnté Salabert
00:48:21.990 - 00:48:22.870
This is where Owen.
Colin True
00:48:23.110 - 00:48:40.550
This is where he bows out. Any. Any wildlife any running into.
By the way, the algorithms are listening because ever since our multiple episodes about hugging bison or people trying to get too close to bison, I feel like every third Instagram reel I'm being served now are people like getting charged at by bison. So it's kind of funny.
Shawnté Salabert
00:48:41.030 - 00:49:36.960
Wow, I didn't realize it was happening at such a high rate. Apparently no you know, and I haven't heard normally. Well, I did see a baby bear, a little bear cub. Yeah. That was up in Tuolumne Meadow.
And we got to watch because people. People see bear cubs and they're like, oh, so cute. Except for Tuolumne Meadows, you've got a road running through it.
So the rangers did what they do very well and they hazed the bear to make it afraid of the road because so what you saw is rangers just running full bore at this bear. There was like five of them, and they're making all sorts of noises. They've got devices. They're shaking, screaming at this bear.
And the bear's like, oh, hell no. Runs up into the forest where it belongs. So that was it.
But that's, you know, that is a total symptom of people being a little too friendly with animals they shouldn't be. Is now the animals don't know, like, is this safe or not, that they're needed to learn that is not safe to be there.
Colin True
00:49:38.080 - 00:49:44.480
Didn't know if, you know, psychiatric terror on bears is a public, you know, post. It's like a job you can get, actually. Probably was cut by Doge.
Shawnté Salabert
00:49:45.680 - 00:49:48.880
Hopefully. Probably. Maybe it's reintroduced in the big ugly bills.
Colin True
00:49:48.880 - 00:49:52.620
We do like to impose you horrible memories on a baby bear.
Shawnté Salabert
00:49:52.780 - 00:49:59.820
Oh, my God. Yeah, I think it's the same guys who are doing the sweeps in my neighborhood would love to do that. Just give them a mask and.
Colin True
00:50:00.300 - 00:50:07.660
Oh, my God. Yeah, that's still going on. You've been missed out on that. That hasn't ended since you've been on trail. So sorry to inform you of that.
Shawnté Salabert
00:50:07.980 - 00:51:16.420
Yeah, it's hard. It's like being out here. One of the nice things is being able to dip out a bit from everything. But then there's.
There is a weird guilt that comes with it because you realize the privilege of being able to dip out of things and being able to, like, you know, we had some pretty horrible stuff going on right on, like, on my block. I don't, you know, I don't know. I live in Pasadena and we've had sweeps in my neighborhood.
I live in a really amazing neighborhood filled with lots of great people, and people are being taken from bus stops and things like that. And so, you know, leaving that where there was this big. People were coming together in the community to take care of each other.
And then coming out here thinking about how Lee kept trying to. To sell off all our public lands. Glad that that got taken out. But, you know, you realize you can't divorce the like.
When people say hiking isn't political, everything is. It's all connected. It's all connected for better or worse. And you don't.
There are certainly people out here who I think don't think about any of this. I'm not one of those people. I can't like politics follow me wherever I go. So sure, you know, it's nice to dip out, but I'm not dipped out.
Yeah, it's a double edged sword. I don't know.
Colin True
00:51:16.740 - 00:51:32.180
Well, does it not end on a down note? I guess the real question is what is the process to get a trail name change? Because I appreciate that you're rustic.
I'm sure you've been rustic a whole long time. But I think you should now be Gear Abbey officially. You know, it'd be pretty great to introduce yourself as Gear Abbey.
Shawnté Salabert
00:51:32.180 - 00:51:40.220
You know, maybe after the show debuts, you know, you realize you're saying something and nobody listening knows what you're talking about because we've never discussed it on the rock fight before.
Colin True
00:51:40.220 - 00:51:42.020
Yeah, we're just sort of leasing, you know.
Shawnté Salabert
00:51:42.020 - 00:51:48.100
Yeah. Gear Abby, answering your burning questions about outdoor people, places, products, pastimes, and apparently poop.
Colin True
00:51:48.900 - 00:51:52.020
What do you mean apparently? Like it was built into the charter, you know.
Shawnté Salabert
00:51:52.980 - 00:51:57.860
Built into the charter. I didn't sign any forms yet, Colin. Oh my goodness.
Colin True
00:51:58.580 - 00:52:02.420
All right, well, what's next? How much longer do you have on your next stretch?
Shawnté Salabert
00:52:02.900 - 00:52:37.920
My next stretch is a week, so I've got. It's basically broken up into three weeks the way I did it. So next stretch is a week.
I'm going to get up into some territory that I love up in the evolution basin and be do some side quests, maybe see some more marmots. If I'm lucky, I will resist touching them. I've seen the headlines. So yeah, that's what's up next.
I'm going to deal with my food right about now and probably start shoving. But hiker hunger has hit so I am probably start adding whatever chocolate the store here has into my backpack immediately. So calorie dense foods.
Colin True
00:52:38.800 - 00:52:46.860
Well, stay safe out there. Don't hug any animals like you said or unless you want to videotape it happening. So we can then talk about on the podcast then I encourage you.
Yeah, exactly.
Shawnté Salabert
00:52:47.020 - 00:52:49.260
I'll try to send it off before the bear mauls me.
Colin True
00:52:49.500 - 00:52:50.460
That's like look at me.
Chris DeMakes
00:52:50.460 - 00:52:51.180
Oh God.
Shawnté Salabert
00:52:51.900 - 00:52:53.740
Barry Ver. No hozog of me.
Colin True
00:52:54.140 - 00:52:55.740
Stay safe out there, Shantae.
Shawnté Salabert
00:52:56.140 - 00:52:57.740
Thanks, Colin. Miss you guys.
Colin True
00:52:58.700 - 00:52:59.740
Talk to you soon.
Shawnté Salabert
00:52:59.900 - 00:53:04.820
Why is that funny? Wait a minute. You can't end it on that note, laughing at me. I don't. You know what? I don't.
Colin True
00:53:04.820 - 00:53:06.140
I'm sorry. We miss you, too.
Shawnté Salabert
00:53:06.700 - 00:53:07.900
Why aren't you the best?
Chris DeMakes
00:53:09.100 - 00:53:09.500
How?
Shawnté Salabert
00:53:09.900 - 00:53:12.590
All right. I'm just going to carry that with me for the next week.
Colin True
00:53:12.590 - 00:53:18.310
I wanted to keep you guessing, give you something to think about while you're out there by yourself with your empty thoughts, you know? Now you have something to get you on.
Shawnté Salabert
00:53:18.310 - 00:53:21.550
Yeah. Does Colin actually even like me at all? Oh, my God.
Colin True
00:53:21.550 - 00:53:22.910
Of course. I'm sorry.
Shawnté Salabert
00:53:23.070 - 00:53:28.910
Oh, man. Anyway, thanks for listening to this mumbo jumbo, Rock fighters. Hope you guys are hanging in there.
Colin True
00:53:30.430 - 00:53:48.100
All right, that's the show for today. The rock fight's a production of rock fight llc. For Owen Comerford. For John Frederick. For Shantae Salibare, I'm Colin Drew. Thanks for listening.
And here he is to take us out, it's Kristen makes with the rock fight fight song. We'll see you next time. Rock fighters.
Chris DeMakes
00:54:04.810 - 00:54:48.820
We talk about human powered outdoor activities and big bites about topics that we find interesting like pop culture, music, the latest movie reviews, ideas that aim for the head. This is where we speak our truth. This is where we speak our truth. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Welcome to the rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight.
Welcome to the rock flight. Rock light, Rock fight. Rock light, Rock fight. Rock fight. Welcome to the rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight.
