MEC Got Acquired... Now What? Plus: A Win For Public Lands!
- colin7931
- 3 hours ago
- 35 min read
After months of rumors and speculation, on May 16th MEC finally announced that they have indeed been acquired. One of the group that has purchased MEC from Kingswood Capital Management is also their Chief Merchandising Officer, Chris Speyer.
Today on the show Chris sits down with Colin and Eoin Comerford to talk about MEC's new ownership group, where the brand is and where it's going. (04:00)
Then Colin is joined by Tania Lown-Hecht from the Outdoor Alliance who has an update on the plan to sell off hundreds of thousands of acres of public lands in Utah and Nevada. Spoiler alert: It's actually good news! (38:00)
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Episode Transcript:
Colin True
00:00:00.800 - 00:04:07.440
Don't let our big time production value and celebrity names fool you. Looking at you, producer Dave. But Rock Fight, LLC is a small business and growing brand.
And even though we have our own consigliere who advises on other matters, we've got to consult a lawyer now and then on the legal structures that every business needs. But for a small business like ours, the cost to hire general counsel or pay your retainer is a non starter. So what's an outdoorsy founder to do?
I mean, come on, we're not flashing around that outside money. Enter Conatus Council.
They can help your business with fractional general counsel and legal services, from strategy consulting to advocacy and government affairs to real world implementation for outdoor recreation industry businesses. Forrest over at Conatus Council has helped Rock Fight navigate some of these areas.
And let me tell you, knowing someone has your back means you can focus on running your business. I mean, he had at least three edits to this read to quote unquote, protect us from ourselves. I mean, that's what I'm talking about.
So you got questions? Konatuscouncil.com is where you go to get in touch with Forest. Hey. And the first six hours are free. Wait, what? I can't say that.
Oh, initial consultations are free. Okay, fine. Head to conatuscouncil.com today. Welcome to the Rock Fight, where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows, and sometimes agree to disagree.
This is an outdoor podcast that aims for the head. I'm Colin True, and today we're learning a little more about the recent acquisition of MEC and celebrating a win for public lands.
But before we get to that, have you voted for who drafted the best list of outdoor towns? The answer is me, obviously. Head to Rockfight Co to listen to the 2025 outdoor town draft and vote for your favorite roster of outdoor towns.
And lastly, you hitting the Switchback in June.
If so, come hang out with producer Dave, with Owen Comeifer, with Chante Salibaran, with me when we record a live episode of the Rock fight on Tuesday, June 17th at 5 o' clock at switchback in the Trail Heads Theater. Hope to see you there. Okay, we'll be right back.
Hey, everyone, before we keep going here, I need to tell you about our teammates at Darby Communications.
Like I've been telling you, if you run an outdoor and endurance or an active lifestyle brand, there is no better PR and digital marketing, belay partner or drinking buddy than Darby. They can help your business reach new heights. And they might just keep you from falling on your Ass.
Since we started working with Darby, more and more people, and this is an important point now. Guys, I want you to hear me on this. More and more people have reached out to us here at the Rock Fight because of that messaging.
Look, guys, I'm dead serious. If they can help us, they can help anybody. Hit them up@darbycommunications.com do it today. All right.
Back in January here on the Rock Fight, we had our outdoor industry insider and personal consigliery Owen Comerford, on to respond to some rumors floating around that MEC was about to be sold. And it was last month revealed who that buyer was. And now, per a press release that came out on May 16, the that sales official and in the books.
And a group of Canadians led by Tim Goo, who has a stake in both Roots and Tilly, was joined by MEC CEO Peter Helinski and Chief Merchandising Officer Chris Speyer to buy the venerable Canadian outdoor retailer from Kingswood Capital Management. Chris Spire is an interesting addition to the ownership group as he has been with MEC in the CMO role since last July.
But previous to that, Chris held the same role at rei, a place where he worked for seven years before returning to his native Canada and and ultimately becoming part owner of the Canadian equivalent to rei.
And today, Chris joins Owen and I to talk about the acquisition, where MEC is today, and where MEC can go in the future, and then stick around after that as Tanya Lone Hecht from the Outdoor alliance returns to the POD to talk about the big win that went down this week for our public lands. Welcome back to the Rock Fight, where today it's MEC was acquired. Now, what with Chris Spire. All right.
Along with Captain Owen Comerford, we're here today with Chris Spyer, the chief merchandising officer for mec. Welcome to the show, Chris.
Chris Speyer
00:04:08.000 - 00:04:09.920
Oh, great to be here. Good to see you.
Colin True
00:04:10.720 - 00:04:16.560
Yeah. You reached out. You said you're a fan, you wanted to come on. We're like, yeah, sure, you can come on. It's fine, you know, Absolutely.
Chris Speyer
00:04:16.560 - 00:04:18.080
Well, thank you. I appreciate that.
Colin True
00:04:19.040 - 00:04:22.160
Not everyone gets to, you know, we say no to a lot of people, so.
Chris Speyer
00:04:22.960 - 00:04:40.850
Well, I'm glad I passed through whatever the crucible was to be able to join this illustrious group, but I do love the pod and I, I do listen and I have been paying attention as, as Mountain equipment company has, you know, been a topic of conversation over the last couple of months. So glad to be on.
Colin True
00:04:41.570 - 00:04:48.130
Well, you know, we need to raise the opinion of the. Of Americans in the eyes of Canadians right now. So we're not really saying no to many Canadians.
Eoin Comerford
00:04:48.210 - 00:04:50.370
Any kind of cross border outreach is good.
Chris Speyer
00:04:51.330 - 00:04:55.890
We know there are many, many great Americans, so that. That's not an issue.
Colin True
00:04:56.470 - 00:05:14.790
Well, to your point, let's get into what we brought you on here to talk about.
You know, we've been sort of tracking the potential acquisition of MEC since last fall here on the Rock fight, including little leaked details about who your new owner could possibly be as recently as just a few weeks ago. So let's start with your new owner. Like the big, the big announcement now that everything's official. Who owns mec?
Chris Speyer
00:05:15.030 - 00:05:58.170
Yeah, it is a Canadian investment group. It is led by a gentleman by the name of Tim Gu. I think this, this came out informally a couple of weeks ago.
And Tim has like a very deep background in manufacturing in Canadian retail and investment. He is a shareholder in Roots. He's an owner of Tilly, Best known as for the Hats, and does manufacturing for brands like Canada Goose.
So he's kind of an ideal partner in the mix. And then our CEO, Peter Hlinsky and myself, that's the, that's the investment group.
Colin True
00:05:58.330 - 00:06:00.250
Oh, so you join, you're in the investment group.
Eoin Comerford
00:06:00.330 - 00:06:02.570
Yeah, I didn't get that part. All right, cool.
Chris Speyer
00:06:02.650 - 00:06:12.010
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think, you know, it is really important in our opinion.
You know, we, we sort of had a little bingo card on all the guesses that were coming in.
Eoin Comerford
00:06:13.690 - 00:06:19.130
I got them all wrong, by the way. I had some good guesses, I thought, but they were all wrong.
Chris Speyer
00:06:19.950 - 00:06:51.250
I thought you did too. So this was one that I think a lot of people were not really aware of Tim and what he does, at least from a management perspective.
I think both Peter and I believe enough in the model that we thought investing in it made sense. And we thought that was really going to matter to MEC members and to the trade on the other side of this as well.
So I'm a huge believer in mec, both rhetorically and also financially.
Colin True
00:06:51.970 - 00:07:02.770
We were going to. We're definitely wanted to ask you about your time at REI down the road, but. And you know, why you made the move north.
But I guess, you know, owning part of REI wasn't in the cards. So this probably, this probably played a big role here.
Chris Speyer
00:07:02.770 - 00:07:07.490
Technically I was a part owner, but it was a much smaller percentage.
Eoin Comerford
00:07:08.290 - 00:07:11.410
Kind of the same as ours as any other member.
Chris Speyer
00:07:12.560 - 00:07:13.080
Exactly.
Colin True
00:07:13.080 - 00:07:24.800
Well, the press release about the acquisition references a lot of the pride you had that your new owner is Canadian. I mean, why, why do you really. And including yourself, clearly you were telling us off mic, you're originally from Ottawa.
Like, why is that such a crucial component here?
Chris Speyer
00:07:24.960 - 00:07:53.290
Yeah, I think this would have mattered anytime. You know, I think this, it's hard to understand maybe if you're in the United States.
So maybe just going back like MEC was formed in 1971, there was a very similar story probably to REI.
In fact, the original members were sourcing goods from REI, driving down across the border and bringing them back up to support like good quality product for their climbing habits.
Eoin Comerford
00:07:53.290 - 00:08:00.330
And because it was just across the border. Right. They were in Vancouver, REI was in, was in Seattle.
Chris Speyer
00:08:00.730 - 00:09:42.650
That's exactly right, Owen. And similar to rei, the founding members, it became a co op, a cooperative and. But it really became like an iconic part of Canadiana in some ways.
It was where you went for good advice, it was where you went for high quality gear. It was kind of the national chain, but it felt like it understood local activities and again, sort of did a lot of good.
And so there was a huge amount of pride in.
And so this idea, I probably like a lot of other people when it went through some financial distress and had to go through restructuring in 2020 was like, Ah, what is going to happen to MEC? Are Canadians going to support an American owned entity and are they comfortable with it moving to being a company versus a co op?
And you know, again, this idea felt like there was something uniquely Canadian that may be going away. And you know, I would then character. If you add on to that, you know, we probably lost a lot of members who were uncomfortable with that transition.
Then you have places like the Hudson's Bay Company, hbc that are going through their own, you know, restructuring. There's American ownership.
And then I don't know if you guys have heard, but there was some rhetoric recently around sovereignty and around Canadian identity and around trade.
Colin True
00:09:42.650 - 00:09:46.890
We are all too familiar residents of the United States.
Eoin Comerford
00:09:47.290 - 00:09:48.250
We're living it.
Chris Speyer
00:09:48.330 - 00:10:55.930
So yeah, so I think like if you take this moment you would say, wow, you have this uniquely Canadian retail outdoor retailer that is coming back to being Canadian owned.
It's happening in a moment where there's distress across Canadian retail and places like Hudson's Bay Company, you know, it has been well publicized the distress they're going through with their ownership.
And then you have this idea that like, of Canadians really becoming more aware of supporting Canadian brands, Canadian businesses and their own identity. And so we thought, you know, this, I mean, we couldn't have planned this in a better way. In some ways in terms of timing to make the announcement.
And we wanted to make sure that Canadians knew we were coming home, so to speak, and that the investment group behind it, you know, had Canadian roots. And we were all longtime MEC members and you know, anxious to, anxious to bring that identity back to the business.
Eoin Comerford
00:10:56.570 - 00:11:07.850
Because I was interested even to read Canadian Tire actually buying the brands from hbc, just as again, part of that whole sort of national identity, national pride around Canadian retail.
Chris Speyer
00:11:08.970 - 00:11:49.710
I think this is important. Canadian Tire, although people may not operate or yell about their pride for Canadian Tire, it's another uniquely Canadian proposition.
We are an incredible retailer in terms of who they target and what they do. So I'm glad to see that the brand didn't get licensed out, you know, to some sort of weird owner. But I'm.
But I think like this idea of Canadian brands, Canadian Identity and MEC, I think is going to be really powerful right now especially, but for the next 50 years, we hope it's powerful.
Eoin Comerford
00:11:50.190 - 00:11:55.870
So if you could give us sort of the 10,000 foot view of where is MEC in 2025.
Chris Speyer
00:11:56.110 - 00:14:43.260
Yeah, I mean, I joined the company in August 2024 and we really wrote down three things that we shared both internally and externally that we had to do. One was that we had to find new ownership.
I think we had, you know, we were coming to the sort of the natural sunset of the investment phase for the private equity group. The second thing we had to do is stabilize the margin in sales.
We had probably become like many, far too dependent on not like talking about the value of our expertise and all the other pieces that make us unique. And really just 20 off, 30 off, 40 off. And we had some inventory challenges, like a lot of folks in the, in the outdoors.
And then last, you know, being candid, we needed to really improve vendor engagement because I think there were a lot of questions as it relates to the stability of the business, some pretty well publicized past due issues that we needed to solve. So in 2025 we really like, we focused on our starting point being basically December of 2024. And we stopped, you know, kind of like all promotions.
We had quarterly vendor summits to connect with our vendors, be completely transparent around where we are, where we're going and how you can partner with us. And listen candidly, the vendors wanted and needed us to succeed as well.
Because one more unhealthy, you know, filing, especially in a country like Canada, isn't going to help anybody, you know, and we really needed to like, look hard at who was going to be the two kind of Pieces were Canadian. Like that needed to be our lead investor and they needed to come at it from a long term investment thesis versus short term overall.
So in 2025, you know, we've doubled down on our core activities of camp, hike, climb, backpack.
In terms of the stories we're telling, we are, we've run five months positive comps now with 4% sales growth, but more importantly, double digigit margin growth. And ultimately, you know, this all culminated in new ownership that we were able to announce in May.
So I would say in terms of where we are, you know, I think we've stabilized the business. We've got the vendors partnering with us effectively and we found the ownership that we think sets us up for good future.
And we're not kind of exploring a million things. We're leaning on this idea of focus on the core activities where I think Canadians expect us to be.
Eoin Comerford
00:14:43.340 - 00:15:10.590
It's interesting you should talk about that because I'd say if there's a critique maybe of some of the bigger retailers in the U.S.
it's that they're moving away from the core activities and that they're getting into run that they are all about lifestyle or athleisure or it's all viori and apparel. Sounds like you aren't going that direction. You're maybe going back a little bit to being a true outdoor store, if you will.
Chris Speyer
00:15:10.670 - 00:16:26.620
I mean, I think it is so important to understand your core identity for the customer. And so our permission really sits with the customer. I think on the trail. The trail is kind of where all this begins.
And so you can think about adjacencies.
And so when I think about run trail run is a really natural adjacency because I think, and I think like cycling or watercraft are good natural adjacencies. I think there's a terrific growth opportunity around versatility and active outdoors versus yoga for the outdoors.
And so I think that's how we're approaching this is not to try to invent ourselves in other ways where we don't have a lot of permission.
It's really like double down on the core activities we have because we think like hiking is probably more relevant than it's been in a very long time.
It could be a day hike or it could be multiple, multi day, but then build your concentric sort of activities off of that versus like try to recreate yourself overnight. That's just my opinion and I think it's like what the customer is expecting from us right now.
Colin True
00:16:27.000 - 00:17:13.860
No, I think you're spot on.
I Mean, the authenticity conversation, I think sometimes gets misunderstood by people in the industry where it's, you know, hey, if you're doing something outside, you're doing something outdoor. And I think that is a positive mindset in terms of getting in for participation, for welcoming more people into the fold. But you're right.
But you know, Owen, to your point, what we're seeing here and kind of what you're describing, Chris, like if the retail base, like where you go to get your stuff, like that definitely needs to adhere to the authenticity of those activities. And it doesn't mean there's not going to be things for the fringes.
Well, but it's, you know, it's kind of a little bit of the engagement of the activity versus the, the business of the activity. And when you dilute the business of the activity, then it gets like, that's just not as, I don't know, it's just not what it was. It's not.
The identity is lost. Right, right.
Chris Speyer
00:17:13.860 - 00:17:14.260
Yeah.
Eoin Comerford
00:17:14.340 - 00:17:16.980
Just because you can sell it doesn't mean you should sell it.
Colin True
00:17:16.980 - 00:17:17.940
Right, right, right.
Eoin Comerford
00:17:18.020 - 00:17:38.420
And, and ultimately it's not like, you know, it's not like your stores are getting bigger, so you have to make specific decisions about what you're going to have in those stores.
And so every pair of, you know, road running shoes or really lifestyle shoes, if we're being honest, that you put on the wall, you're pushing off, you know, a pair of hiking boots, you know, a pair of climbing shoes or whatever.
Chris Speyer
00:17:38.580 - 00:17:53.420
Yeah.
And I think, I think your customer, I mean, the customer has to be at the center of all of this in terms of who you really want to walk into your store. And I think we sometimes don't give them enough credit for the critical eye they have of what your wall.
Colin True
00:17:54.290 - 00:17:55.410
Oh, yeah, I agree with that.
Chris Speyer
00:17:55.410 - 00:18:07.810
And the assortments that you create for them and, and they can see when you're drifting probably before you can, you know, in terms of when you're chasing economics versus chasing like their engagement and.
Eoin Comerford
00:18:07.810 - 00:18:28.530
Long term, you know, loyalty in talking about stores. MEC has 20 something stores today, 26 stores currently. Gotcha. So a few years from now, are we going to see about the same number of stores?
A few more. A lot more. Less. I mean, what's the macro level thought there?
Chris Speyer
00:18:28.690 - 00:19:04.259
I don't know that we've gone down to the detail on right now, but we do think there are communities across the country that an MEC could use an mec and so we think there's probably good natural organic growth.
I think our Focus though is just making sure we get the core really healthy so that when we do invest in expansion, we're doing it with like a healthy balance sheet and a lot of clarity on who we are so that when we walk into the market we aren't, we aren't stretching ourselves at this point.
Eoin Comerford
00:19:04.500 - 00:19:57.480
And back on merch just for a second.
So you and I were chatting a little bit on LinkedIn that about the private brand part of MEC and you know, one of the things that, you know that I noticed when I was in the. Is it Kings Road location? Is that a thing? Yeah. In Toronto was the, the breadth of the MEC product, especially on the equipment side.
There were PAX tents, I mean almost, you name it there, there was, it was in the MEC brand. Now this was, gosh, probably a decade ago now that I'm going back, but. But I was surprised that actually your private brand is. It's under 50%.
Quite a bit under 50% of the total. Is that something that now with new ownership we're going to see more new interesting MEC branded product or that's not really part of the plan?
Chris Speyer
00:19:58.520 - 00:22:07.250
I think it is definitely part of the plan in terms of thinking about our own MEC label. I mean, the benefit we have with MEC label is the brand really actually means something like we're not in a, we're not inventing an identity.
I think the two non negotiables when we get into the product really need to be. Is it like a physical manifestation of our expertise in the space? And then secondly, is it like adding a value prop so that it is more accessible?
And as you think about your assortment, then through the lens of like how you're answering the question for different consumers, hopefully what MEC label does is like, wow, they really know what they're doing in the outdoors. And two, this is relatively affordable if I don't want to have whatever label on my chest or on my back.
And we think there's probably a bigger opportunity for us to continue to grow in that space.
I would say we would like that growth to come less over sort of skew and style proliferation and more around more depth in core programs like our outerwear or like our packs or our base layer programs where we actually think we have a significant opportunity to grow and be complementary to other brands that are on the floor. It is important fact like MEC really didn't have a lot of brands for a very, very long time and never discounted anything.
And so the penetration was very high because you Had a lot of people who were very entrepreneurial, who were like passionate about the activities, making fleece and making packs and making bags. And that's sort of the genesis of why the penetration was so high to begin with.
I think if I've got this right, Patagonia was like the first external outerwear brand to actually be part of of mec. It's relatively recent that actually MEC started to carry like a lot of third party brands.
Colin True
00:22:07.410 - 00:22:20.770
Well, so putting on that in your role, you know, one of the best parts of the industry is that constant flow of new emerging brands.
You know, as the chief kind of merchandiser, is there any, are there any category opportunities you'd be excited about or new brands you're excited about?
Chris Speyer
00:22:20.930 - 00:24:44.480
I mean, very personally I think this opportunity of made in Canada and leveraging, you know, kind of Tim's expertise is something we're going to be leaning into, particularly on the soft goods side of the business. We think that'll be new and interesting for us. And then, you know, I, I am very optimistic on this idea of hiking. I think hiking can be confused.
Like for a super technical activity, hiking can be walking.
In terms of the categories I'm quite bullish on, I would really love to see us expand in what you need on your feet, what you need on your body and what you need on your back. I look at brands like Norda right now in Canada and I'm incredibly excited about what they're doing in terms of innovation and newness.
Cieli is an amazing brand right now that's emerging.
And then I think about like brands like Nemo who are just, you know, thinking about innovation and materials, thinking about how to make a better product all the time and doing it with values that, you know, I deeply appreciate and I think our member does. And I'm very bullish on kind of where they're going. And in terms of trends, I love what I see in terms of versatility.
And I think versatility is such a hard thing to execute because it can't be proxy for compromise. And so this idea of like my gravel bike that I can put a set of 28C tires on that or I can run a set of 40s and that becomes like a good one bike.
You know, I, I see that happening all over the place in the outdoor industry that people are thinking about how to make a better product that works for multiple activities versus just sort of singular one activity and, and circularity and trade in is something particularly through the lens of kids we want to lean into because we think that is going to matter a lot if you want to have a serious sustainability conversation. This idea of multiple owners is actually the real solution versus I think materials are important.
I think there's a lot that's important in that conversation. But ultimately, nothing is more sustainable than, again, a product having a really, really long life.
Colin True
00:24:44.960 - 00:24:57.360
It's the only thing that's been proven so far is secondhand. Right? I mean, to kind of keep it in circulation. Lots of things.
People are trying to solve other problems for sustainability, but that's the one thing that has worked to date, is keep it in use much longer.
Eoin Comerford
00:24:57.600 - 00:25:49.800
I think the hike focus is really interesting and it's something actually that I think Colin and I have talked about quite a bit offline as really just.
It's important for so many reasons, not the least of which is that the barriers to entry are so low and we just need to get more people outdoors and in these sort of activities. And hiking leads to backpacking, leads to whatever. Whatever, right?
But nobody is going to go on a backpacking trip as their very first outdoor adventure. I mean, almost nobody. So that's why it's key.
And I think the other your versatility comment is, you know, if you, if you're creating apparel, you're creating, you know, pants, you're creating tops or whatever for. For hiking, more than likely, they are awesome for everyday living, but not the other way around. Right? So.
So all of those things that make a great hiking pant, to me, make a great everyday pant. So y. I think that's a really interesting take.
Chris Speyer
00:25:50.440 - 00:26:48.260
You know, one of the brands I love, and I think there are different, you know, ways of looking at this, but like, Viori is an example of a brand that I've watched be really successful in my former life.
I think, I think it is really up to being a really good merchant in terms of how you think about the appropriate use case for your customer of a brand like that as an example. And that is like, is that a really great short to go for, like a good run, a good paddle, and maybe like a good hike?
And to me, that's a really good product then. And I think that is like the right position for a brand like Viori and an MEC as an example.
I think the wrong position is to try to make it into and yourself into something that it's not, which is kind of, again, a pure lifestyle offering or activities that may not, like, matter as much or may not look authentic to our customer.
Colin True
00:26:48.580 - 00:26:58.820
You know, we mentioned Rei earlier.
There's definitely Some undeniable parallels between MEC and rei, where, like we mentioned, you spent some time there before ultimately coming to mec. Can you tell us about that journey? Like how.
Eoin Comerford
00:26:58.820 - 00:27:00.900
Yeah, how long? You were there for a while.
Colin True
00:27:01.220 - 00:27:04.180
You took all the trade secrets and scrambled across the border.
Chris Speyer
00:27:04.180 - 00:27:26.480
You know, I joined REI October 30, 2017.
I only remember that because I think I took the risk of dressing up as Tigger for a Halloween party on October 31st, which was on your second day of work. Me with the staff there.
Eoin Comerford
00:27:26.480 - 00:27:28.000
So that's a tone set.
Colin True
00:27:28.480 - 00:27:30.880
Yeah. Bold move, buddy. Nice work. I hope it went well.
Chris Speyer
00:27:32.000 - 00:27:34.960
It went okay, I think. Not too much recovery.
Colin True
00:27:35.440 - 00:27:37.920
There were three other Tiggers. People were pissed, you know.
Chris Speyer
00:27:40.640 - 00:28:08.650
Yeah. So I was there for seven years. I started with the co op brands team.
That was what I was originally brought into to lead, and then over time, expanded my remit into the broader merchandising group. So it was an amazing seven years, and it is a pretty amazing place. I have nothing but the love and appreciation for rei.
Eoin Comerford
00:28:08.730 - 00:28:27.610
So what led you then to NBC? Because typically you get to the sort of the top of the mountain with an REI in the outdoor industry.
It's rare to say, well, actually, I'm going to go over here for a similar role with a smaller player. So take us through that decision if you could.
Chris Speyer
00:28:27.850 - 00:29:29.680
Yeah, it was interesting because ultimately it all started in spring of 24, and I had a call with Peter Helinski, the CEO here. Less to think about employment and more to think about just comparing notes on what was happening in the broader outdoor.
And so during the course of that conversation, Peter was just sharing, you know, he was recently in seat as CEO, sharing what he thought the opportunities were, being very transparent around some of the challenges he was facing. And, you know, I am an unapologetic fan of mec, and so I was just talking to him a lot about, like, holy shit.
I like, I'm so impressed with what you've done because there was, like, an alternative path after the restructuring that this thing just, like, goes away. And so you haven't explored pickleball and selling of other weird stuff.
Colin True
00:29:29.680 - 00:29:38.320
Not to Rock fighter right there. Sorry to interrupt you, but nice job, Chris. All right. We can slag on pickleball a little bit in any episode. We will. Sorry, keep going.
Chris Speyer
00:29:39.360 - 00:31:25.150
But I was just so impressed with the fact that the core had remained. And so we had, again, an informal just coffee together as we were going through the conversation.
He did share that there was likely going to need to be a transaction in the future. And frankly, I started to think, Gosh, I'm 55. I've done a lot in my career.
The idea of potentially adding a ton of value coming into an organization that could use it in terms of just thinking through its product strategy, its identity, and then potentially, you know, being part of an investment group or. Or having an ownership or an equity stake. I mean, those. Those were always, like, the things that drove me to do this at this point in my career.
And frankly, like, I didn't feel like there was a huge amount of downside if. If. If. If it was a swing and a miss. And.
And so, yeah, a lot of people thought I was totally crazy because I don't know if they totally understood, you know, the draw of coming home. You know, that's part of it, but also just I'm a believer. Like, I have been a believer since the beginning in this. In this. In this brand.
And, yeah, so that's what. That's what drove me to join it and to be part of, you know, revitalizing the organization.
And last Friday was, for me, kind of a dream come true, that now I'm actually part of the organization, not just as an employee, but also that I'm invested in it.
Colin True
00:31:25.230 - 00:32:06.530
Yeah. And I'm sure, if you're able to comment on it.
But a couple things I was thinking about when you're mentioning your reasons for returning to MEC and how you describe what MEC is focusing on, and the renewed focus got really, almost like, bringing it back to the core, like Owen described. And I think if there's a criticism right now of rei, it's a little of, like, what's going on, a lot of hires from.
From outside the industry, a little more maybe, of a broader sense.
And I feel like if I'm in your shoes, frankly, the MEC seems more in line with my values and what I would care about and more what I would want to be a part of. And again, I'm not. I'm sure that it would be out of school for you to say anything to that.
To that comment, but it just feels more like what you're describing feels like what I would like to see REI do more of as well, or at least publicly.
Chris Speyer
00:32:06.530 - 00:33:12.090
Yeah, I mean, the industry needs a healthy rei. I think that is. I think nobody can argue with that. Like, there's an ecosystem that needs to exist.
And I think, like, there are remarkably talented and passionate people that are at rei.
And Mary Beth who came in, I mean, I knew her when she was a board member, obviously, Like, I do have a huge amount of belief that she comes in thinking the right thoughts, having the right ideas, and ready to do the right thing. So I have a lot of belief, you know, there. And I mean, and frankly, like, they'll find their way. But, you know, these are unusual times.
I mean, we talk about COVID like it's the past, but Covid is still with us in terms of all the impacts it's had on different businesses. So they'll find their way. They have enough talent and they have enough passionate fans to do. To do it.
Eoin Comerford
00:33:12.490 - 00:33:28.570
So as you sit here, we sit here in 2025 announcing this new acquisition. Really, we think about the future. So take us to 2030. Where do you see MEC in five years?
Chris Speyer
00:33:28.730 - 00:33:41.350
Oh, and I feel like it's such a trap to talk about five years now, just because, I don't know, like, every five years, things seem to turn. Every five months, things seem to turn upside down. Right.
Colin True
00:33:41.350 - 00:33:49.310
Now, listen, you know, Canada will be the 51st state by then, right? You know, Trump will be on his, like, fourth term. Like, you know.
Chris Speyer
00:33:49.390 - 00:36:16.580
No, no, sorry there. I feel like. I feel like.
I feel like if we're doing this right, you know, listen, there's four things that in 2030, you should be able to see from us without fail, and that is that you walk into a store, because I still think brick and mortar is the heart of where outdoor experiences begin. You should walk into a store, and you should feel like a deep connection to the expertise of the person on the floor.
If we've lost that, then we are losing to Canadian Tire and others that are out there. Second, you should have a sense of, like, deep curation, and you should see a heavier penetration of our expertise in our own label showing up.
And you should see less total brands, but more depth than the ones that we're focusing on.
You should see that it has become, like, the rallying point for the community in terms of how we create community in our store, because I think that's something MEC does incredibly well. And I would say that you also see our values front and center in terms of the work we're doing around the trail.
So I know those aren't, like, big, crazy answers, frankly. Like, my taste right now for the word transformation is really low.
I think this idea of focusing on fundamentals is powerful and is kind of like the way through the challenges. So expertise, curation, community and values, and doing the hard work to execute on how those four things show up for the customer.
That will mean a super healthy MEC I would say the one thing I would love to push us on is how we show up to an urban or a suburban customer. I think we tend to look at the activity of climb through the lens of, like, the outdoor crag.
But, yep, I'll go to Toronto and the amount of gyms that are around and the amount of people, I probably need to, like, shift my thinking for how I think about that activity in some cases through an urban setting or what it means to get out on a trail in downtown Toronto and be a source for that.
But we have to be careful with those things to get, like, the core healthy before we start to think about how to solve large problems or, like, larger assortment and strategy challenges. Just like that.
Colin True
00:36:16.980 - 00:36:25.940
Hey, Chief Merton, Chief Merchant saying, you know, a smaller assortment is. That's kind of a rock throne. So, yeah, like that. Anything we missed, you feel like Chris.
Chris Speyer
00:36:26.180 - 00:37:32.000
You know, the only. And this may be just like the Canadian in me, the hopeful Canadian.
But, you know, the one thing I do think it's good for all of us to think about is, like, the customer. And personally, I still think the outdoors is ridiculously relevant to mental health, physical health.
And so I know in the industry, we're sort of consumed by inventory and customer behavior.
But, man, I think in the next six months and year, this idea of getting out for a walk or getting out for a run or getting out to go camping and separate from all the madness is going to be more important than it's been in a long time. And I hope, like, we all remember why we got into it in the first place, you know, to just go, like, take care of yourself.
And our customers are taking care of themselves. And I think that's.
I think that's just, like, got to be at the heart of a lot of how we're thinking right now around how to get back to health and why what we do is actually important.
Colin True
00:37:32.400 - 00:37:48.210
Well, Chris Beyer, CMO up at mec. Thanks for spending some time with us. Really appreciate you coming on and congrats on the job on the new ownership, which includes yourself.
So great to see what's going to happen with MEC in the next few years.
Chris Speyer
00:37:48.370 - 00:37:59.090
Well, lots of work to do, but really appreciate the time. And again, we'll be listening for interesting insights and what's happening in the outdoors through the rock fight.
Colin True
00:37:59.500 - 00:38:00.380
Appreciate it. Thanks, Chris.
Chris DeMakes
00:38:01.580 - 00:38:03.020
It's time for a party.
Chris Speyer
00:38:03.180 - 00:38:03.580
Sh.
Colin True
00:38:05.500 - 00:38:22.140
All right, so we're recording this at 11:30 Pacific Time on Thursday, May 22nd. And this wasn't originally going to be part of Friday's episode of the Rock Fight.
But we wanted to bring Tanya Lone Hecht, who is the VP of communications for the Outdoor alliance, back on the show to talk about a big win for public lands that went down late yesterday. How are we doing, Tanya?
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:38:23.260 - 00:38:25.100
We're doing well. Thank you for having me.
Colin True
00:38:25.960 - 00:38:37.480
See, Tanya thinks that she's all amped up because she decided to kill a spider, but she's. But she's actually sounds great. I don't know if anyone supports public lands can just go around killing spiders. I think there's a.
Yeah, don't tell people that.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:38:37.480 - 00:38:39.960
The only thing scarier than spiders is Congress.
Colin True
00:38:40.520 - 00:38:51.920
I did read that the spiders in your house that I used to try and trap and put outside, like, actually, if they go outside, they'll probably just die anyway. So it's like, it's okay to kill house spiders. I don't know if that's true or not, but I'm just gonna.
Makes me feel less guilty about killing house spiders.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:38:51.920 - 00:38:55.320
You know what? The spiders can be outside. If they're outside, I will not bother them.
Colin True
00:38:55.740 - 00:39:00.060
Natural environment people. So, yes. You're not hanging out in their house, like, trying to freak them out.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:39:00.460 - 00:39:01.100
Exactly.
Colin True
00:39:01.180 - 00:39:02.500
Double standard here. Spiders.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:39:02.500 - 00:39:10.860
This is my space. I need to get to my desk. I don't want you crawling on me. This guy was aggressive, though. He was huge. And run. Swear running toward me.
Colin True
00:39:11.580 - 00:39:13.980
Just hit gym shorts on a little sweatband.
Eoin Comerford
00:39:14.220 - 00:39:15.100
I'm gonna get her.
Colin True
00:39:15.900 - 00:39:16.380
Yes.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:39:16.380 - 00:39:19.340
He had his techno playing. He was like, I'm gonna kill that one.
Colin True
00:39:20.380 - 00:39:49.520
All right. Well, spiders aside, we have a breaking update from our friends at the Outdoor Line.
So kind of the kind of conservation general, the call to action from the last time Tanya popped on the show, which was the intention to. That worked. Apparently.
It was the intention to sell off upwards of hundreds of thousands of acres of public lands in Nevada and Utah that was being incorporated into the proposed reconciliation bill by our Republican controlled. Congress has been stripped from that bill. So it worked. It all. Can we take the credit? Is it you and me?
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:39:49.520 - 00:40:47.400
We can totally take the credit. We can absolutely take the credit. So, yeah, the context, as you mentioned, was Congress is trying to pass this huge spending package.
And at the last minute, during a markup in the House Natural Resources Committee, two lawmakers added this amendment that would sell off like half a million acres of public land. People were really upset about it. Understandably. We shouldn't sell off public lands to pay for spending and tax cuts.
And so we have had a ton of outreach. I mean, we generated about 100,000 letters in a few weeks. We've had meetings with tons and tons of people. At the same time, lots of.
Of other people have been doing stuff on the Hill. Representative Zinke and Representative Vasquez just put together this public lands caucus and have a bunch of new members.
So this is a bipartisan caucus of folks who want to support public lands. Zinke in particular, worked really hard to help strip this amendment out of the final package.
Colin True
00:40:47.480 - 00:40:50.800
God, I just don't want to say nice things about Ryan Zinke, but, God, good job.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:40:50.800 - 00:40:53.760
You know, you got to see the good and praise it, right?
Colin True
00:40:53.760 - 00:40:54.200
You do.
Chris Speyer
00:40:54.200 - 00:40:54.880
It's kind of like.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:40:55.270 - 00:41:06.110
It's kind of like when you're raising kids, you want to name the qualities that you want to see. So public lands are bipartisan. Lawmakers can see that, they care about it. They're starting to stand up for public lands.
Colin True
00:41:06.110 - 00:41:06.790
That's awesome.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:41:07.110 - 00:42:22.380
Yeah. So it has been a little bit frantic. You had written me earlier in the week saying, is there anything going on this week?
And I thought, no, it's going to be quiet. And then yesterday, here we are. Yesterday afternoon, we got the full text of the bill that came out of the House Rules Committee.
So that's like the last step of all the committees before they send the bill to the whole House floor for everyone to vote. So it got out and the House was like, we're going to vote on this tonight. We're going to stay up all night and try to get this passed.
And when that text came out, the public land sales were gone, which is awesome. Two more things were stripped out of it that are also great. There was an attack on the Bureau of Land Management's resource management plan.
So basically, these are plans for how we should take care of BLM lands.
Bunch of plans that the outdoor alliance worked on quite a bit that helped protect thousands of miles of trail, almost a thousand climbing areas, whitewater paddling. So these are really important. That also got pulled out.
And then Ambler Road had been opened up in the original version up in Alaska, and that also got pulled. So we got. We did claw back some of the stuff. And that bill passed in the very early hours of this morning. So there's still a lot of bad stuff in it.
Colin True
00:42:22.380 - 00:42:23.420
Right? I mean, that's kind of the thing.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:42:23.420 - 00:42:24.140
It's a shitty bill.
Colin True
00:42:24.140 - 00:42:26.980
It's a shitty bill. I mean, this is great and obviously.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:42:26.980 - 00:42:28.820
This is great and it still sucks.
Colin True
00:42:28.900 - 00:42:30.340
Yeah, exactly. Right.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:42:31.540 - 00:42:41.380
So we are really pleased to see some of this, like, really bad stuff clawed back and our voices clearly worked, and that's really important. We're really pleased with that.
Colin True
00:42:41.780 - 00:43:17.790
No, it just shows that maybe we can get things done. You know, it was. It was interesting.
Like, I got within a matter of minutes, I saw the press release from the outdoor rec roundtable, and I got an email from Adam, Adam Kramer of the Outdoor Lights being like, it was like bang, bang, bang to start, all coming at once. Like, it's out, it's out, it's out. And, you know, I guess we'll see. You know, maybe we're finally through the. A little bit of the chaos.
The chaos will continue, I'm sure, but, like, of, you know, just so much happening now. We're starting to see, okay, where is the pushback going to work? Where are they going to draw the line, you know, and are they really that committed?
Maybe. I'm sure they're going to try again. But at least there's a precedent now of, like, there's ways that we can prevent some of this from happening.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:43:18.660 - 00:43:33.540
Definitely. Definitely. I mean, it's made a huge difference, I think.
And it's really encouraging to see that when lots of people are speaking up, lots of people are writing stories about this, that it changes what happens in Congress. So it worked.
Colin True
00:43:33.780 - 00:43:48.940
A big thing that you guys have been concerned about, people talk about, is obviously opening up monuments, other areas. I mean, is that any different really than this?
Are there ways that we could be back into the fight where maybe it won't be as positive an outcome on other topics, or is it all kind of the same thing?
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:43:48.940 - 00:44:51.000
Do you think the monuments are a little bit different because that's administrative? So that means that's the president doing it. This is Congress introducing a bill, legislation. They'll pass it. The president will sign it.
The monuments will be probably, if that happens, it'll be executive action. And I mean, there's been lots of rumors swirling that the administration wants to scale back a bunch of monuments.
It's dubious whether that's legal, to scale back monuments. And that is more challenging because the executive branch does have different kinds of authority than Congress has.
But at the same time, Congress is still the best place to make change. So your members of Congress were elected to represent you.
You can write to them and you can tell them what makes you mad, you can tell them what you don't like, and then they will go to the administration and try to change things in terms of those administrative actions. So if, you know, if it comes to monument rollbacks, though, there will definitely be things for the outdoor community to do.
That will make a difference there. And in terms of other legislative work.
Colin True
00:44:51.080 - 00:44:52.200
Yeah. What else is going on?
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:44:52.200 - 00:45:45.690
The job's not done on this bill, so it's passed the House, but the Senate still has to pass it. And, you know, the Senate also has.
They have a narrow majority, and they're going to want to do things a little bit differently than the House, so there's still room to play here.
And so right now is actually like, a really good moment to write to both your House representative and both of your senators and say to your House Rep.
Like, I'm either I'm glad that you voted against this bill, or I'm, you know, disappointed that you voted for this bill, or I see that you did some things to get the worst out of it, and I still don't like this bill. You can, you know, we have template messages that will adjust depending on how your representative voted.
And then to write your senators and say, hey, I saw this passed. I'm glad that land sales weren't in it.
I still think the bill is going to be a big threat to the outdoors, and let's see how much more progress we can make.
Colin True
00:45:46.650 - 00:45:58.730
Yeah, I guess. Good to not, not turn the faucet off. Right.
If somebody did something, well, you still, you want to praise them after the fact and just because maybe the one thing got pulled out, like, just don't turn it off. Right. Go let them know, hey, good job, good job, buddy.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:45:59.130 - 00:46:32.220
I mean, that's really. I think the secret to good advocacy is following up after your member has done something. Because it's one thing. Right.
If you're an elected member of Congress and someone writes you and says, hey, do this, do this, do this. And then you do it. And they never say thank you or you don't do it.
More importantly, and they never come back and say, hey, I'm upset about this, then you think no one's even watching me. Like, I can do whatever I want and they're not even seeing.
So some ways, I think writing to your member after they've made a vote is even more important because it says, you know, I'm watching you. Like, I have my eyes on you.
Colin True
00:46:32.380 - 00:46:34.140
Like that spider in your kitchen.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:46:34.220 - 00:46:35.020
Exactly.
Colin True
00:46:38.620 - 00:46:41.820
All right. Anything else? Anything? Or I guess that's enough for this week, right?
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:46:42.620 - 00:46:47.140
That's it for this week. Yeah. I was like, up at 5am doing this so well.
Colin True
00:46:47.140 - 00:46:57.980
I was starting to think, like, God, the way this is going, we might be hearing from Tanya weekly. I'm like, wow, okay, maybe, maybe, maybe we won't have Back to back weeks. We still made it. We still are back to back week.
So maybe, maybe next week we won't have to talk, but we'll see where we end up, I guess. Next week.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:46:57.980 - 00:47:00.620
Yeah. If we're talking next week, I promise I'll get a real microphone.
Colin True
00:47:03.340 - 00:47:28.120
That means that this is game on. And like I'll buy you one at that point. Like. All right. Sorry, Tanya. You're coming on the show every week. You need drone microphone.
Well, thanks so much for keeping us updated. Thanks for all the work you do. We'll put more links in the show, notes to who you should be reaching out to.
Now, I'm sure they're similar to the last time, but we'll repost them again. So if you need, if you want to take that action, take that action.
And you know, Tanya, thanks for what you guys are doing and we'll see you next time we have to talk about this stuff.
Tania Lown-Hecht
00:47:28.760 - 00:47:29.800
Thank you, Colin.
Colin True
00:47:30.920 - 00:47:49.710
All right, that's the show. Thanks to our guest today, Chris Spire and Tanya Lone Hecht. We want your emails, send them to myrock.
The Rock Fight is a production of Rock Fight LLC for Owen Comerford. I'm Colin True. Thanks for listening. Here to take us out to our guy, Chris Demaikz with the Rock Fight Fight song. We'll see you next time.
Rock fighters.
Chris DeMakes
00:47:49.710 - 00:48:48.840
Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight.
Welcome to the Rock Fight where we speak our truth, slay stuff and sometimes agree to disagree.
We talk about human powered outdoor activities and big bites about topics that we find interesting like pop culture music, the latest movie reviews, ideas that aim for the head. This is where we speak our truth. This is where we speak our truth.
Rock Psych Rock side Rock side welcome to the Rock flight Rock flight Rock flight Welcome to the Rock Flight Rock flight Rock fight. Rock flight Rock flight Rock fight welcome to the Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight Rock.