Natural Selection on the Trail, Camino Boot Failures & Should You Crash a Trade Show?
- 2 days ago
- 39 min read
In the latest episode of Gear Abby, Shawnté Salabert and producer Colin True celebrate a quarter-century milestone (25 episodes!) the only way they know how: by discussing sex science, ultralight gear controversies, Mount Baldy rescues, heel-lock lacing techniques, and whether America should just let natural selection handle national park safety.
It’s chaotic. It’s thoughtful. It’s deeply on-brand.
Pre-Question: Enlightened Equipment & Ethical Headlights
Before diving into listener mail, Shawnté addresses a recent controversy surrounding ultralight brand Enlightened Equipment, whose tactical arm “Defense Mechanisms” drew criticism after allegedly sharing extremist-coded content online.
While many outdoor brands maintain military or law enforcement contracts (a reality many consumers don’t fully realize), the issue here wasn’t the existence of tactical gear — it was how it was marketed.
The takeaway?Outdoor consumers should:
Understand how brands operate
Shop according to their values
Avoid reactionary dog-piling; but also avoid willful ignorance
As Colin bluntly summarizes: do your research, then decide what you’re comfortable supporting.
Question 1: Should We Remove Safety Railings and Let Darwin Handle It?
Mike in Maine writes in with a spicy take: if people keep getting rescued from mountains like Mount Baldy, should we just remove the guardrails and let nature sort it out?
Shawnté takes a nuanced stance.
Yes:
Personal responsibility matters.
People should understand risk before venturing into winter mountaineering terrain.
Mount Baldy in winter is not “just a hike.”
But also:
National Parks and public lands serve a wide audience.
Railings, cables (like on Half Dome or Angel’s Landing), and signage allow more people to experience iconic places safely.
Removing infrastructure won’t magically prevent poor decision-making.
The distinction? Front-country access vs. wilderness self-reliance.
If you want zero railings and total freedom? The backcountry exists. But public lands are meant to be shared. Colin’s East Coast comparison to Mount Washington highlights the same reality: accessibility plus weather plus inexperience equals headlines.
Safety features don’t eliminate Darwin. They just reduce unnecessary tragedies.
Question 2: Camino Blisters & The Boot Betrayal
Bethany is prepping for her lifelong dream: hiking the Camino.Problem? Her Christmas-gift boots are shredding her feet.
Shawnté’s diagnosis: this isn’t just “breaking them in.” This is a fit issue.First Fixes to Try:
Heel lock (lace lock) technique to prevent foot slippage
Thicker socks or liner socks to adjust volume
Replace factory insoles with something more supportive (Superfeet recommended)
Consider half-size adjustments
Explore narrower European brands if foot volume is low
If blisters are already forming:
Lubrication (Aquaphor, Body Glide, etc.)
Toe socks (Injinji fans know)
KT tape on high-friction spots
But here’s the bigger truth: The Camino is non-technical, town-heavy, and long.Heavy boots may simply be overkill.
Shawnté’s honest advice? Consider trail runners or lightweight hiking shoes instead.
Question 3: Should I Attend Switchback Trade Show on My Own Dime?
Trade Booth Barging Boris works at REI and misses the retailer training events that have been scaled back. He’s considering paying his own way to attend Switchback in New Orleans. Is it worth it?
Shawnté says trade shows offer:
Industry education sessions
Trend insights
Panel discussions
Brand relationship building
Networking magic that can shape careers
She credits trade shows with launching her own writing career through connections made on show floors.
Colin adds a practical note:
Trade shows are industry-only events — you need proper credentials.
If you’re serious about staying in the industry long-term, it can be a worthwhile investment.
But be clear about your goals before spending the money.
In short:Yes, there’s value — if you go with purpose.
The Episode Takeaway
Episode 25 is classic Gear Abby:
A little irreverent
A little nerdy
A little fist-shaking
A lot thoughtful
And if there’s one unifying theme? Personal responsibility matters.But so does compassion.
And maybe… don’t pet the bison.
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Episode Transcript:
Shawnté Salabert
00:00:03.200 - 00:01:08.520
You got questions going out of your mind. Someone with answers. Now that's hard to find. Like the what and the why and the how stuff works or just where to go to avoid all the jerks.
She's Gear Abby. Gear Abby. Gear Abby. Advice that doesn't suck. Gear Abby.
Hello there, my outdoorsy friends, and welcome to Gear Abby, where we tackle the controversial, weird, obscure and taboo topics that other outdoor podcasts refuse to touch.
I'm outdoor educ writer Shawnté Salabert and I'm here to answer your burning questions about our relationships with outdoor people, products, places and pastimes. And I want them all, because remember, there are no dumb questions, just smart advice. All righty. Here's how it works.
You're going to send Questions to dear gear abbymail.com and I'm going to answer a few each week here on the show and along for the ride.
Joining me today and every week is my partner in gear, the producer of Gear Abby and a guy who shakes his fist so much I'm worried that one day it might fall right off. Colin. True.
Colin True
00:01:08.520 - 00:01:14.840
You know, considering what we were talking about right before we hit record, I don't know if I like that as a, as my intro today.
Shawnté Salabert
00:01:15.320 - 00:01:19.240
I think it's a perfect intro. You should tell the people what we are talking about right before.
Colin True
00:01:19.240 - 00:01:39.140
Well, Gabby, there was a new study published in Physiology and Behavior that has shown that sexual activity shortly before high intensity exercise does not harm athletic performance. I saw this at a press release that came out today and I clicked the link and I'm like, okay, I thought that's something we had already known.
Shawnté Salabert
00:01:39.700 - 00:01:47.500
I mean, didn't we? Should we be sending this to the tarantulas, to the elk? Like who, who else needs to hear this?
Maybe there's some species that aren't, aren't across it yet.
Colin True
00:01:47.500 - 00:02:01.420
I didn't think about that. This is, I think a largely human based study, but maybe we should look at doing some animals because that's a good point.
You're out in the wild, you don't know what's coming.
You know, you don't know if that was a little bit of time for nookie before you're about to get chased down by a larger person, larger animal in the food chain, right?
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:01.420 - 00:02:07.140
Yeah. And I don't, I don't think like moose and stuff are reading scientific journals. So someone's got to bring it to them, right?
Colin True
00:02:07.140 - 00:02:16.720
Moose notoriously worried about their physical performance. You know, like an athletic performance. They use Strava a lot. I've been told, you know, as they're wandering around the Utah woods.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:17.200 - 00:02:23.559
That's right. The only person they follow is Killian Journey. Just for inspiration. That's right. So they could try to be more aerodynamic, I guess.
Colin True
00:02:23.559 - 00:02:26.000
Fast Moose, I believe, is Killian's actual nickname.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:26.160 - 00:02:52.300
Yeah, it is. Yeah. It's unconfirmed, but I believe in it. I saw it on Reddit once. You know, that gotta be true. It is. Well, you know what I love?
It's good for us to keep talking about these topics we love, like, you know, sexual relationship relations in the outdoors. Because today is. Is our 25th. We're a quarter of a century old in podcast years. This is our 25th episode. I like that we have a theme.
People know at this point that there are certain things they can expect from us.
Colin True
00:02:52.700 - 00:02:57.660
Like on trail, masturbation, apparently is on. On the. That's something that just comes up around.
Shawnté Salabert
00:02:57.660 - 00:03:00.940
Here, I think maybe just on your side of the screen right now, Colin.
Colin True
00:03:00.940 - 00:03:05.500
Well, listen, you can do that, and it won't impact your performance that day on your hike, is my point.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:05.500 - 00:03:07.640
That's true. That's true. Something to consider.
Colin True
00:03:08.680 - 00:03:11.800
Wait, wait 25 years? So each episode is a year?
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:11.800 - 00:03:13.480
Is that what it feels like?
Colin True
00:03:13.480 - 00:03:14.200
Oh, wow.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:14.200 - 00:03:17.640
Okay. I mean, you're over there editing it, so I don't know.
Colin True
00:03:17.720 - 00:03:18.600
It's a joy.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:18.840 - 00:03:22.720
You know, it's also a joy is skimming the outdoor headlights.
Colin True
00:03:22.720 - 00:03:23.160
Oh, yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:23.160 - 00:03:32.520
And I wish. I wish we had some good animal mating rituals to talk about, but instead I got this ultralight gear maker, enlightened equipment.
I've got their quilts. I love it.
Colin True
00:03:33.040 - 00:03:35.440
So you're an enlightened equipment user.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:35.920 - 00:03:37.120
I am a user.
Colin True
00:03:37.120 - 00:03:39.280
Okay. Makes this story a little tougher.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:39.840 - 00:03:53.840
That's. I know. Well, they've been in the news lately, and, you know, not for particularly good reasons, unfortunately.
So a post on the ultralight subreddit earlier this month, Nerd piece on the trek. I know, it's like nerd inception.
Colin True
00:03:54.640 - 00:03:55.240
We love you.
Shawnté Salabert
00:03:55.240 - 00:04:08.380
Just kidding. Me too. But they dove into the brand's tactical equipment arm defense mechanisms.
They make gear that's pretty much marketed toward law enforcement, enforcement, military use. And here's the thing. Like, that's really common.
Colin True
00:04:08.380 - 00:04:09.180
Really common.
Shawnté Salabert
00:04:09.500 - 00:04:10.140
So common.
Colin True
00:04:10.140 - 00:04:10.620
Like, it's.
Shawnté Salabert
00:04:10.620 - 00:04:46.060
Listen, all of the technological innovation that happens in the outdoor industry. I'm actually shocked that more people don't realize this. Like, you got.
Patagonia spent 40 years, I think, contracting these clothing for the military. Arcterics has a whole dedicated line called leaf.
That's law enforcement and armed forces There I think they actually don't contract with the military, but they get a line. But yeah, other folks, granite gear, outdoor research, darn tough Farm to Fleet Danner, they all have tactical lines and military contracts.
And I think as of a few years ago I saw outdoor research made almost half of its annual revenue from those contracts.
Colin True
00:04:46.620 - 00:05:04.480
Borderline irresponsible. If you are an outdoor brand and you do actually want to make money one day and you're not figuring out how to sell to the military.
When I was at Polar Tech, I was the sales director for North America. Our number that if we made our number annually was totally dictated by what the military did.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:04.880 - 00:05:16.960
Yeah, it makes sense. I mean, think about the history of outdoor gear.
A lot of it is tied and this is across the world, not just in the U.S. but a lot of it is tied to armies. You know, that's why a lot of.
Colin True
00:05:16.960 - 00:05:21.760
Those innovations wars have been fought and won by those who had the better equipment. Sorry, sorry.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:21.760 - 00:05:23.440
Folks wearing their Patagonia vests.
Colin True
00:05:23.440 - 00:05:24.000
Yeah, right.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:24.160 - 00:05:26.640
Their quarter zips are really what won those wars.
Colin True
00:05:26.640 - 00:05:27.120
Yes.
Shawnté Salabert
00:05:27.790 - 00:06:12.610
But anyway, okay, so the story is not about that, that I just want people to know that because I think a lot of people are always surprised when they hear about this. And to be. Okay, so to be fair, none of these brands, these are like law enforcement, firefighters, military.
None of these brands are marketing to the basement dwelling, paramilitary cosplay persons. Oh, except for the Reddit commenter pointed out the defense mechanisms.
That's the enlightened equipment tactical arm was actually posting some sort of like dog whistle content that's pretty different from how most brands market this stuff. And of speaks exactly to those extremist militia types like Proud Boys, Boogaloo movement, all that jazz.
I don't know if you saw, did you see that the CEO Chris Shabao and the owner Tim Marshall jumped into the Reddit forums and started kind of.
Colin True
00:06:12.610 - 00:06:14.490
Like, oh yeah, a lot of backpedaling.
Shawnté Salabert
00:06:14.890 - 00:06:23.850
There was so much backpedaling. They're like, listen, hey, we're anti racist. We're, we're not right wing extremists. We, we didn't know about these dog whistles.
I didn't realize that could be bad.
Colin True
00:06:23.850 - 00:06:25.040
Should we make a dog whistle?
Shawnté Salabert
00:06:25.510 - 00:07:16.320
Should we make one? Should we manufacture an ultralight and sell it on ggg? No. But yeah, I, I, I think it's really interesting.
I heard from several people emailed me about this and that's why I decided to bring it up today that this whole thing made them decide not to buy Enlightened equipment anymore. And even the, the guys from the brand in those Reddit threads were like, listen, I get it if you guys are turned off.
Like, we figure a lot of people are probably going to be put out by this. So I don't know. I think at the end of the day, this is a good call for all of us outdoorsy folks.
Just have a better understanding of the companies you're buying from and how the industry works. And that is across the board, from toothpaste to toilet paper. I mean, I think in general, amazing.
Like, Americans are kind of a lazy, reactionary bunch. And it's a lot easier to just join the online dog pile after the fact instead of doing your research and shopping by your values up front.
Colin True
00:07:16.320 - 00:07:16.800
Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:07:17.470 - 00:07:18.950
Yeah, that's how we do things. Here it is.
Colin True
00:07:18.950 - 00:07:59.810
I mean, look, if you look at some of the posts, they're pretty hard, I think, to look back and say, we didn't, we didn't know it was that one. It was like, whoa. This is, there's, there's some reasons to be concerned.
At the same time, though, the sort of then grandstanding by the, you know, like you said at the beginning of talking about the military thing. What, they make those for the, for the military. It's like so, like on both sides, I'm like, I want to like, shake both of you.
Like, it's like, okay, number one, you should not have been posting the things you were posting. Number two, wake the fuck up. And also either be okay with it or don't be okay with it, but just do your research, you know, and shop accordingly.
Shawnté Salabert
00:08:00.530 - 00:08:04.890
That's right. Yeah. Colin, I don't know if I've really said that's right to you a whole lot.
Colin True
00:08:04.890 - 00:08:06.610
I love it when you do it gets me so excited.
Shawnté Salabert
00:08:06.610 - 00:08:25.550
I want you. Yeah, yeah. Hold that in your heart, okay, buddy? I love that. I like, I like.
By the way, we haven't gotten any negative feedback on it, but I like that you and I are giving ourselves a little extra bonus time at the beginning of the pod to chat amongst ourselves. And also with all of you listening this.
Colin True
00:08:25.550 - 00:08:28.190
It's the, it's the fist shaking part of the, of the episode.
Shawnté Salabert
00:08:28.190 - 00:08:41.990
Yeah, it's real important. I mean, we decided in that, you know, I. So far, he still has both hands. I just want you guys to know that. Doing all right. But. Yeah.
Well, you are here for the question and answer portion of this program. So, Colin, let's kick things off.
Colin True
00:08:41.990 - 00:09:23.520
Okay, here we go. First question of the day.
Dear Gear Abby, I live out east, but My buddy lives out your way and was telling me that the Forest Service keeps shutting down one of your local mountains because people are stupid and keep needing to be rescued because they go out into bad weather and shit like that. This guy. This is like one of my people here. It got us talking, okay, arguing about how many safety features. Safety in quotes.
Safety features exist in the national parks.
Railings, signs, even those cables that are up Angel's Landing in Half Dome and whether or not we should take them down and just let natural selection do its own thing. What say ye? Signed Mike in Maine. Mike, great email.
Shawnté Salabert
00:09:23.600 - 00:09:27.520
Is this really Mike, or was this you, Colin? Are you. Is this not Colin writing in again?
Colin True
00:09:27.520 - 00:09:39.200
Listen, I like my sort of surly disposition was forged in New England, so I definitely feel a kindred connection here with Mike and Maine, but this is not me. This is definitely not me. This is a great question, but in.
Shawnté Salabert
00:09:39.200 - 00:09:41.010
The same spirit of you, it was the end.
Colin True
00:09:41.170 - 00:09:43.170
Like, that. I'm like, yeah, that I know you, Mike.
Shawnté Salabert
00:09:43.650 - 00:10:07.890
You're like, I. I see you. I recognize you. I feel you in my heart. All right, well, I can't wait to hear what you have to say on this, Colin. But.
All right, Mike, since you are apparently a real person, judging from the tone of your email and the whole people are stupid and natural selection bits, I'm guessing you probably land on the side of ripping down all the railings and embracing a bit of that Darwinism you spoke of. Apologies if I'm wrong, but I'm going to guess that I'm not.
Colin True
00:10:07.890 - 00:10:11.010
We could host the Darwin Awards on this podcast. I think that would be okay.
Shawnté Salabert
00:10:11.680 - 00:10:20.080
We could. We could. Okay, I. You would that. Maybe that's the year end for 2026, outdoor category only.
Colin True
00:10:20.080 - 00:10:20.560
Of course.
Shawnté Salabert
00:10:20.560 - 00:11:25.780
We'll workshop that. Okay. But. All right, listen, Mike, first of all, your friend was probably talking about Mount Baldy.
That's the tallest peak in the San Gabriel mountains here in SoCal, and it's kind of like nature's bat signal for SoCal hikers, which we've talked about in the past in light of some deaths on the mountain this winter. People just cannot stay away from this thing, even when it's covered in snow and ice. But I have to say, it's a pretty. It's a pret.
Pretty sexy mountains. I know you get. I get the allure. It's a saucy up there. But, yeah, it is a pretty rare thing for the Forest Service to close trails for safety reasons.
Like, we've definitely had closures after fires, and that is A safety reason, of course, but it's pretty. Pretty obvious. And I'm.
But I'm generally all for keeping access open to public lands as much as possible and allowing people to, by and large, mitigate their own risk. Like, that is generally where I fall on this spectrum.
And I can also understand, though, that local search and rescue crews are probably super tapped out at this point, that there's this whole cycle of, like, big storm, unprepared humans, multiple accidents that just keeps happening.
Colin True
00:11:26.420 - 00:11:34.740
We're getting this. We're going to get snow next week. So look for that.
Like, look for baldy to be in the news about 10 days or three or four days after maybe when this comes out.
Shawnté Salabert
00:11:35.300 - 00:11:36.420
Yeah, it'll be this week.
Colin True
00:11:36.420 - 00:11:36.820
Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:11:37.940 - 00:11:48.320
Hopefully not. Hopefully, people, because it's. It's actually closed through, I think, the 20th or something. For this reason.
For this reason, Colin, because they're tired, man. They don't want to keep rescuing your ass.
Colin True
00:11:48.400 - 00:11:49.240
Reopen. But okay.
Shawnté Salabert
00:11:49.240 - 00:14:23.130
All right. Snowy mountain. Well, I think it did, and then it closed again preemptively. Yeah, womp, womp. But listen, in my.
In my own dream world here, you've heard me talk about this on the podcast. I love education.
I wish that the Forest Service, National Park Service, since the peak, is actually part of the San Gabriel Mountains National Monument.
I wish, you know, maybe they could have a ranger stationed at the trailhead to talk to people and just, like, go over gear that might be safe to use on the mountain. Whether or not you have the knowledge to be out there, I really do think a lot of people just don't know. Like, they get excited. I get it.
Like I said, it's a sexy mountain, but, yeah, people just don't understand. I'm going to guess Mike is not for that. Mike is like, hell, no, we're not doing this.
We don't need those safety measures like actual humans teaching other humans. So. All right, Mike, we're going. We're going to dig into your question here. I don't think you're alone, dude.
All right, there are a lot of people who wish that every railing, fence, sign was removed so that nature was more natural. Nature is nature intended and all that jazz. The thinking is usually along the lines of this.
The only people that should be going here are the people who have earned the right by having the skills, the equipment, the knowledge, the confidence to be here without those, quote, railings, any kind of safety measures that, you know, kind of install this false sense of security in people who maybe shouldn't be in these places.
And that ultimately I think the bottom line for folks who believe this is like safety is your own personal responsibility, which is not a terrible bottom line. Right. You know, I can't, I can't argue with that as a whole, but especially that last bit, I'd say, yeah, it, you know, it is.
You got to know yourself, you got to know what you're capable of, know your limits and know the environment you're going into. Know how to do risk assessment. So understanding like Mount Baldy, for instance, not a hike in the winter, okay?
It's a full on mountaineering experience. And you got to know what you're doing and have the right equipment before you even sink like a single cramp on point into the.
But I'm going to give you a counterpoint because you know me. I think so. Some places you, you talked about Half Dome, you mentioned Angels Landing, Mike.
Some places, such as, I don't know, near waterfalls in Yosemite.
In those places, having railings, having warning signs actually does allow more people to enjoy those areas while theoretically reducing the risk of injury or, you know, death.
And it reduces the stress on park staff who might have to probably respond to a whole lot more emergencies because people are still going to go to these places. Places. Okay. Like you taking the railing out isn't going to stop, you know, somebody in their family coming from Ohio or overseas or whatever.
That's what Mike just thinks.
Colin True
00:14:23.130 - 00:14:26.210
Those people just chuck themselves right off the edge, you know, like, all right.
Shawnté Salabert
00:14:26.210 - 00:15:05.020
Sorry Ohio guy lemmings. Oh, sorry Ohioans. We know you're smarter than that.
But yeah, listen, the park actually does have a certain responsibility to mitigate risk for the visitors. Like this is part of their, their whole thing as a land manager is you gotta manage the land and the people who use it. So.
And you want to manage it in a way that allows people to use it.
Yosemite has actually had a staff geologist for 20 years and one of his responsibilities is literally monitoring for potential rockfall that could fall on people and, you know, crack their heads open. So, you know, they take it pretty seriously. I like that.
Colin True
00:15:05.020 - 00:15:08.460
Job description, right? Watch for falling rocks.
Shawnté Salabert
00:15:09.020 - 00:15:10.460
Yeah, you just stand there and look.
Colin True
00:15:10.460 - 00:15:11.420
And yell, get out of there.
Shawnté Salabert
00:15:12.380 - 00:15:12.860
Hey.
Colin True
00:15:15.170 - 00:15:17.570
Great job, great job. Taxpayer money.
Shawnté Salabert
00:15:18.370 - 00:15:20.210
That's right. He does a lot more.
Colin True
00:15:20.610 - 00:15:21.490
He's a geologist.
Shawnté Salabert
00:15:21.730 - 00:16:45.060
Pretty cool dude.
But yeah, listen, any place in the outdoors that has things in, in the US at least that has things like railings, chains, other built in safety features is probably pretty much, quote, front country is how I would put it. Like these are the places that are already seeing a lot of people. They're already pretty packed.
They've already got roads, buildings, infrastructure, like the whole shebang. You know, that area where Half Dome is in us, it's really close to where the waterfalls are. Nevada, you know, Falls is right there.
It's, you know, it's a pretty tiny portion of the whole park.
Most of that park is wilderness, most of which does not have any sign of humans other than the occasional, you know, mileage sign and the trip, the trail itself.
I mean, this is not Europe where we've got via frata bolted into cliffsides on 10,000 foot peaks, you know, so I think here you can pretty easily get away from everybody. Let, let some people have those built environments where they can go and appreciate these beautiful places.
And then if you don't want to be around that, if you don't like the sight of a chain or a railing or a sign, there's a whole lot of backcountry for you, buddy. Okay?
So I think overall, like, while not every person needs to be in every place, it's a good thing to make sure that parts of our public lands are made accessible to the everyday person who might need a little extra guidance on how to stay safe. Like, I don't know, that's. That's my old thing. I'm curious what you, senior fish shaker, have to say about it.
Colin True
00:16:45.300 - 00:18:21.620
I think you covered a lot of it.
I think when it comes to the mountain part of it, and I know we've talked about this in the pod before, the east coast equivalent probably to Mount Baldy is near Mike in New Hampshire. He's in Maine. But in New Hampshire, Mount Washington, where the most deadly mountain in North America because 160 people have died on it.
But that's because it's so easily accessible. But the difference there too is it's cold at the base in the wintertime.
So even if you're making bad decisions, you're at least probably starting with appropriate clothing on versus There are folks here. It's been interesting living in California now for six years in San Diego County.
We get snow in the eastern part of the county, but there are people who've never seen snow in person, right? So like this week, this upcoming storm, we're gonna get snow in the mountains in eastern San Diego County.
There's people who live down here in the lowlands who have never seen it. So definitely, if you, it's not hard to. If you think, oh look, it's 67 degrees and sunny out, I Want to go for a hike? Oh, I heard about Mount Baldy.
It's not much of a stretch to see why people end up in that position. And to Shanti's point, though, that's another reason why there should be some more resources there to prevent that from happening.
When it comes to the, you know, the taking railings down, like, yeah, like, come on, man. Like these big spots where everybody is showing up. You need some guardrails.
You see when people go into backcountry settings and they're still hucking rocks off cliffs that they shouldn't be and that kind of stuff. Right? So. And look, if you want to do that, there are places where you can probably go do that.
I don't recommend it, but you can also, when you're going to a place that is named like this and it's a national park, it's going to have a draw. You better have something up. Right. Just so. Because people are going to make. Even if it's not a Darwin type decision, just sometimes people slip.
Things happen. Like, and, hey, you were on the other side of the rope. You shouldn't have been.
Shawnté Salabert
00:18:21.620 - 00:18:29.420
So, you know, also, by the way, those safety features don't do shit for the people who are already Darwining themselves because they will just go right over them anyway.
Colin True
00:18:29.420 - 00:18:29.900
Exactly.
Shawnté Salabert
00:18:29.900 - 00:18:35.540
So same people are implicated in all of this. The railings just help all the other people.
Colin True
00:18:35.540 - 00:18:44.140
Right. And we have to make sure we have our bison petting zoo that we want to open in Yellowstone for those people as well. Just go right up and pet a bison.
Shawnté Salabert
00:18:44.700 - 00:18:51.580
Yeah, I think. I think that's good. We got to get some investors for it, Colin. Well, now I'm thinking about petting a bison.
Colin True
00:18:52.700 - 00:18:55.180
Every day I think about petting a bison. Shantay, right?
Shawnté Salabert
00:18:55.420 - 00:19:04.180
No, mostly I think about petting marmots. If I'm being real about it, that's my one true dream in this life. Maybe at this point is just to. Can I just.
Colin True
00:19:04.180 - 00:19:08.250
Nobody has wheeled yet a pika and a. Is it pika or pika?
Shawnté Salabert
00:19:09.520 - 00:19:10.880
I think pika, but it might be pika.
Colin True
00:19:10.880 - 00:19:11.760
I've heard people say both.
Shawnté Salabert
00:19:13.520 - 00:20:05.730
I usually say pika. Pika marmot because there's more surface area. I just want my hand, like, deep in it. You know what I'm saying? Deep in that fur. My friend's cat was.
My friend has two cats. She lives in the same courtyard that I do. And they, they. Her. One of her cats comes over to my house every single day.
The other cat is like, whatever, but the other cat is the Fluffier one. And he's like a stocky boy, you know? And today he was. Oh, he's such a cute chunk.
Today he was wandering the courtyard, and he was following me, and then he kept running in front of me and flopping on his side and letting me pet him, and I was like, oh, my God, this is so satisfying. It was, like, calming my nervous system. So, yeah, bison petting zoo. I think we got to get on that. Maybe. Maybe this next question will be about how.
How to get us to their bison. Maybe it's somebody who's like, hey, listen, I knew you were going to ask about this. I've got one. Do you want to come over here? That's my question.
I mean, yes is the answer.
Colin True
00:20:05.730 - 00:20:07.000
Are there a lot of bison on the Camin?
Shawnté Salabert
00:20:08.590 - 00:20:10.190
Oh, oh, we got a Camino question.
Colin True
00:20:10.190 - 00:20:11.230
We have a Camino question.
Shawnté Salabert
00:20:11.230 - 00:20:11.790
All right.
Colin True
00:20:12.030 - 00:20:13.910
A little less bison by. For this one. You don't.
Shawnté Salabert
00:20:13.910 - 00:20:14.870
I mean, I've never. I don't know.
Colin True
00:20:14.870 - 00:20:20.990
Maybe they're importing them. Who knows? You eat pretty well in the Camino, right? You go through towns and stuff. Maybe they're making bison burgers now. I have no idea.
Shawnté Salabert
00:20:23.150 - 00:20:24.470
Oh, boy. All right, read the question.
Colin True
00:20:24.470 - 00:20:32.310
Okay. Dear Gear Abby, I know this isn't as hardcore as some of the things you talk about. We are pretty hardcore around here. Hardcore.
Shawnté Salabert
00:20:32.310 - 00:20:34.190
That's us talking about railings and.
Colin True
00:20:34.910 - 00:20:38.100
But I feel like it hopefully still counts. Oh, of course it counts.
Shawnté Salabert
00:20:38.100 - 00:20:40.500
Oh, it always counts. I always tell you. Send any questions.
Colin True
00:20:40.500 - 00:21:11.670
Send the questions. Dear GearAbby gmail.com. i am planning to hike the Camino in June, which has been a lifelong dream of mine.
I'm deep in my prep right now, and everything is coming together except one really big thing. I started walking in the boots I plan to take, which I got for. Which I got for Christmas from my amazing husband. And they give me horrible blisters.
She put horrible in all caps. So they're really bad. I don't want to say the brand, because I know they work for a lot of people. That's all right.
But I just feel like, please say the brand.
Shawnté Salabert
00:21:11.750 - 00:21:14.870
But I feel like this ain't that kind of podcast. We tell all. Okay?
Colin True
00:21:14.870 - 00:21:50.820
Like we. We speak openly around here. I just feel like my feet are slipping around a lot even though they're my size. Sure, mother.
And they're just rubbing so much on my heel and the front of my foot. I cried the other day. It was so bad. Oh, my goodness. Are there any ways to fix the problem? Or are boots just A bad idea.
My husband is a sweetheart and said he could exchange them to get something that works for me better. So I don't think you're going to be able to exchange them at this point, but something new might be a good idea. We'll see what Shantae has to say.
So I'm open to that if you have suggestions. I just don't want to end up throwing my boots over a cliff like the woman from Wild. Thank you. Signed, Bethany.
Shawnté Salabert
00:21:51.540 - 00:21:53.140
Oh, you took us on a real journey there.
Colin True
00:21:53.219 - 00:21:53.940
Seriously. Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:21:54.020 - 00:21:54.580
Thank you.
Colin True
00:21:54.580 - 00:21:56.420
Yeah, I feel like we're hiking with Bethany right now.
Shawnté Salabert
00:21:56.500 - 00:22:12.190
Oh, Bethany. Well, listen, I don't want you chucking your boots off a cliff either, okay?
You got plenty of time to work out some fixes if you're not leaving till, you know, later this spring, early summer. So let us get you some happy feet, okay? And not the penguins. Just you. Your feet. We're gonna make them better.
Colin True
00:22:12.270 - 00:22:15.070
Even though penguins would be kind of squeezable, too. Like a mar.
Shawnté Salabert
00:22:16.030 - 00:22:31.870
Oh, I would pet that belly so hard. But actually, it's. It's probably very, like. Like, I'm thinking a seal. Oily. Oily. Hey, are there any penguin people who can allow me to pet penguin?
Can I. Are someone sent in that question so I could pull in a penguin special?
Colin True
00:22:31.950 - 00:22:34.430
Welcome to Gear Abbey, where we talk about oily penguins.
Shawnté Salabert
00:22:35.990 - 00:22:40.430
It's a special episode. It's gonna be like, you know, you might have to pay a little bit for that episode.
Colin True
00:22:40.430 - 00:22:43.190
Now, are bison also oily? Let's talk about that.
Shawnté Salabert
00:22:43.750 - 00:22:50.310
We can't. We have so much to find out on this podcast. We're actually just gonna launch a second podcast that's, like, here Abby's Animal Investigation.
Colin True
00:22:50.310 - 00:22:53.270
My poor Bethany's is on, like, waiting. Like, you're. Answer my question.
Shawnté Salabert
00:22:55.350 - 00:23:45.750
Oh, man. All right, Bethany, if you've listened to any of this podcast, then, you know. You know, you know how we work. Okay, listen, I. I have concerned.
I'd say, like, the thing that really stuck out to me the most is this idea. Your. Your tootsies are just around in there.
That tells me that even though you say these boots are your size, some aspect of them is not fitting correctly. So when I have this issue in a shoe, the first thing I try is lacing them up differently.
And I use what's called a heel lock, and you could Google that, see some videos, whatever. This is basically where those top two eyelets in a lot of shoes come in handy. Sometimes they're kind of set off to the side.
In fact, you Basically, just thread the lace up through the bottom of one of the eyelets on one side, then down through the other one, and you leave a little loop there. Do the same on the other side. And then you pull the opposite string through each of those loops and tighten it.
And it creates this little, like, tension system that does a really good job generally of keeping your foot where it needs to be.
Colin True
00:23:45.750 - 00:23:51.630
If you put that in, just say lace lock on YouTube and you'll find a little video, I'm sure, to see what Shantae's talking about.
Shawnté Salabert
00:23:51.790 - 00:23:52.910
Oh, for sure, for sure.
Colin True
00:23:52.910 - 00:23:54.350
Heel lock. Excuse me? Heel lock.
Shawnté Salabert
00:23:55.150 - 00:23:57.790
I think lace lock actually, too. Yeah, that works.
Colin True
00:23:57.790 - 00:23:58.070
Yes.
Shawnté Salabert
00:23:58.070 - 00:23:59.350
You could do it all. Search for.
Colin True
00:23:59.350 - 00:24:00.830
There's no king shaming on this podcast.
Shawnté Salabert
00:24:01.150 - 00:24:04.150
That's right. We haven't said that in a while. It's good to remind you.
Colin True
00:24:04.150 - 00:24:06.830
Well, you know, if you're into heel locks or lace locks, we don't want to offend you.
Shawnté Salabert
00:24:06.830 - 00:25:02.840
You know, cow, brown, chicken, brown cow. Uh, yeah, A little bit of light shibori here. Um, that's for the specialists only. They will know what I'm talking about.
Uh, speaking of, you can actually tighten the lace and, you know, tighten the laces down by your toes. But I like the. Really, the heel lock is the winner here.
And if you do that, Bethany, if things are still sliding around in there like an Olympic ice dancer, you know, there's probably a volume issue, meaning that your foot is not filling out the space correctly. And this. Listen, this is not your foot's fault. I don't want it to get a complex. Okay. All right. Okay. So here's what you do.
If you want to try to fix this. You could try wearing thicker socks to see if that helps.
I used to have a pair of mountaineering boots back when I was getting into ice climbing, and these were. They were a men's size, and that is because I could not find a single damn store in all of California that carried women's mountaineering boots.
Because apparently women don't like to spend time on mountains and definitely don't want to actually try on boots specific to their feet. Feet.
Colin True
00:25:03.240 - 00:25:06.040
The fair sex does not climb mountains.
Shawnté Salabert
00:25:07.560 - 00:25:15.400
Yeah. So these boots were. Were the right length, but they were way too voluminous for my dainty little lady feet, which, by the way, women.
Colin True
00:25:15.400 - 00:25:18.479
Typically have, like, wider feet historically. Like, I mean, that is.
Shawnté Salabert
00:25:18.479 - 00:25:21.000
Mine are white as at this point, they've gotten wider, I think.
Colin True
00:25:21.000 - 00:25:21.400
Yeah.
Shawnté Salabert
00:25:22.200 - 00:25:45.060
Oh, my God. I think it's all the. All the hiking.
But, yeah, listen, I. I ended up just Wearing them with a pair of thin liner socks and then put these ridiculously thick mountaineering, you know, wool socks over them. And that was fine, even if it annoyed the out. Couldn't just find a women's specific boot in a state that is filthy with mountains.
Again, I'm not mad about it. I don't know why I think that, but yeah. So you could do that. You could also maybe with less bitching.
Colin True
00:25:45.300 - 00:25:46.900
I'm shaking her fist now.
Shawnté Salabert
00:25:47.300 - 00:25:59.140
It's me. So every once in a while I gotta, you know, snatch that throne back from you. We'll just bring. We're gonna bring Lloyd on some more.
We're gonna have some regular Lloyd intervals. Although I think generally he's not a fish shaker, so that was good.
Colin True
00:25:59.140 - 00:26:00.620
We'll bring it out of him. It'll be fine.
Shawnté Salabert
00:26:00.620 - 00:26:48.710
Yeah, we'll do our best. Okay. Okay, we'll get that. We'll shake that Minnesota nice right out of him. No, we won't, Lloyd. Don't worry about it.
So anyway, listen, Bethany, you can also try replacing the insole. I mean, there are exceptions, but I would say most shoes come with crappy insoles. They are pretty thin. They're not very supportive.
So you could try out some that are a bit thicker, that have a well developed heel cup. That's the back end that goes around your heel. If you were wondering, super feet are kind of the gold standard here. So check it out. Out.
You know, whatever. You can also try going down half a size, see if that makes a difference.
I mean, at this point, I probably have equal numbers of eight and a half and nine shoes all around my house. Not shoe sizing. Not a perfect science. And I know. Okay, Bethany, I know we said we're gonna blame your feet. I did say that.
But in the end, you may just have lower volume feet. Okay. Like that happens.
Colin True
00:26:48.710 - 00:26:51.710
You're the anti Shanti.
Shawnté Salabert
00:26:51.870 - 00:26:52.270
What?
Colin True
00:26:52.590 - 00:26:53.870
Bizarro Shante.
Shawnté Salabert
00:26:54.430 - 00:26:54.790
What?
Colin True
00:26:54.790 - 00:26:56.320
You said you had wide feet.
Shawnté Salabert
00:26:57.110 - 00:28:18.870
Oh, yeah, I am. Yeah, that's right. You're the anti. Anti Gear Happy. We're only talking about gear Abby's body parts on this podcast. So it's my alter ego now.
We're getting weird as if we weren't before. But listen, if you have lower volume feet, this could mean they're more narrow. Maybe you have a lower instep, lower arch.
You know, they're just a bit lost inside a regular, you know, width boot.
So I recommend going and getting fitted at a running store, or if you don't have a running store near you, go to an Outdoor shop that offers fittings just to understand your foot better. It's just like we talk to Dr. Sports bra. It's just like sports bras. Our feet are all a little different. Sizing is all a little different.
You know, go, go get a little more information about your feet. You might be just fine with a narrower boot, honestly. I mean, I've always found the European brands to be a bit more snug.
Maybe it's because they don't pumping GMOs into their feet, but you know, La Sportiva, Zolo, Loa, Solomon, all of those generally have narrower, you know, narrower lasts, I guess. But anyway, I'd say no matter what boot you end up with, Bethany, you could do a few more things just to minimize the chance of blisters.
I'll say lube up. Okay. You're gonna lube up. We no relation to what we talked about at the beginning of the podcast. I just started slicking Aquaphor between my toes.
Colin is just dying right now.
Colin True
00:28:20.630 - 00:28:26.170
I don't know what to say. I was gonna say there's no K shaming, but is this kind of. I don't know what's going on right now. We're just lubing up our feet.
Shawnté Salabert
00:28:26.170 - 00:28:28.690
Listen, this one's for the foot people, okay?
Colin True
00:28:28.690 - 00:28:29.410
That's right.
Shawnté Salabert
00:28:29.490 - 00:28:30.770
Trying to really. We're trying to.
Colin True
00:28:31.090 - 00:28:33.250
Only fans and they're listening to this podcast.
Shawnté Salabert
00:28:33.250 - 00:29:00.350
That's right. Send all your creepy emails to Colin, not me. Colin also has feet, okay. He's got a family to feed as well. So anyway, I use Aquaphor between my toes.
I don't put it on YouTube and other high friction areas on my feet. Sometimes the sides of my feet depends on the shoes. It has been a game changer for me. You can also use something like body glide.
If the whole thought of Aquaphor or whatever. I've used Carmex. Actually.
Colin True
00:29:00.350 - 00:29:05.270
Wait, when you use body glide because you put body glide in some sensitive spots.
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:07.430 - 00:29:10.550
What do you mean sensitive? I'm not putting it in my butt crack. Colin, I know we talked about.
Colin True
00:29:10.630 - 00:29:11.750
You can people do.
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:12.390 - 00:29:12.790
I don't.
Colin True
00:29:12.790 - 00:29:29.330
Okay. But I'm saying if you're one of those people who do what comes first, the feet or the butt crack?
Do you want to put the butt crack on your feet or your feet in your butt crack? I mean, there's really. This is an important question to answer if you're going to recommend using body glide and you might use it in other.
Do you have a dedicated body glide stick just for your feet?
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:29.490 - 00:29:33.090
Colin, are you Putting body glide in your butt cracks. Like, is that why you're saying wouldn't.
Colin True
00:29:33.090 - 00:29:33.890
Be opposed to it?
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:34.770 - 00:29:42.010
You know, they make other things for that. If I'm, if I'm doing, if I'm worried about butt crack taping, I'm using like a cream. Okay.
Colin True
00:29:42.010 - 00:29:45.490
I'm just saying, okay. Some people might, people use body glide for all sorts of things.
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:45.810 - 00:29:55.510
I mean, use what you want, where you want it, in any order that you want it. Okay. This, this poor woman is like, please, could you just really, this is like.
Colin True
00:29:55.510 - 00:29:58.350
A hall of fame. A question at this point because of all of our, all of our side.
Shawnté Salabert
00:29:59.150 - 00:30:00.150
So many sidebars.
Colin True
00:30:00.150 - 00:30:01.790
Okay. Yeah, sidebars. Thank you. That's the word.
Shawnté Salabert
00:30:02.510 - 00:30:04.190
Side travel, side quests. Really?
Colin True
00:30:04.590 - 00:30:06.430
That's probably what I was trying to say.
Shawnté Salabert
00:30:06.670 - 00:30:16.350
We're gonna go back to feet, which is where we've been just in weird parts. We're gonna, you could try some different socks. Like we said, I love toe socks. Colin loves it when I mispronounce in gingi.
Colin True
00:30:16.350 - 00:30:17.590
There it is. Not in gingi.
Shawnté Salabert
00:30:17.590 - 00:31:23.860
Okay. I did it right that time. Thank you.
But I don't, I, you know, other people swear by darn toughs, whatever you could tape up, I actually love on my heels. I'll slap on a little bit of, you know, KT tape or something similar.
And I think it's so much better than moleskin or those gooey little blister bandages that are creepy when they come off and it stays put forever. But yeah, I think to wrap it up here, your question about are boots a bad idea?
You know, think about what's going to be most comfortable and breathable for you for a month long walk. Okay, I will say my one opinion here is that I think heavy boots are overkill for the Camino. It's a non technical route with a lot of town walking.
And I think most people tend to use hiking shoes or trail runners just because they're lighter. They're going to keep your feet from getting too sweaty, which will, you know, also be a route to blister town.
So I'd say go back to episode two where we had a whole conversation about boots versus trail runners and have a little listen, listen to the chafing episode.
And as much as I would like to spend a month eating cheese and drinking wine while prancing through the European countryside, your feet are the ones that are going to be clocking all those miles. Bethany. So at the end of the day, you do you.
Colin True
00:31:24.900 - 00:31:33.060
All I have to add is that, yeah, you're doing the Camino. So get some Trail Runners, which, by.
Shawnté Salabert
00:31:33.060 - 00:31:35.300
The way, brought to you by Big Trail Runner.
Colin True
00:31:35.460 - 00:31:52.650
That's true. But like, or Road Runners. I mean, honestly, just get the most comfortable shoe that you can spend all day in and you'll probably be fine.
Number two, don't wait so long. I appreciate it's a Christmas present, but like, if this day and age, if a shoe is hurting your foot, move on.
There's too many other options out there.
Shawnté Salabert
00:31:53.290 - 00:33:23.430
Yeah, you want, you want it generally to fit pretty well right out of the box at this point. They make shoes in a lot of different sizes for sure. Makes and models and whatever.
And yeah, if you're, if you're popping it on and you're already feeling pain, it's not the shoe for you, honey. Today's episode of Gear Abbey is presented by the one, the only, the most delightfully alliterative outdoor retailer in the game.
That's right, it's Garage Grown Gear. Want to see the latest and most interesting products coming from the coolest and newest outdoor brands? Yeah, you do.
You're going to head over to garagegrowngear.com and check out the new button and you're going to see awesome things like this. The latest brand to embrace the polartech Alpha revolution. That's tumble on outfitters with their Alpha and grid combo fleece hoodie.
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Amazing brand women owned, clocking in at $119. Oh, you think we're done with Alpha? You're wrong. We're Alpha freaks. And so are the folks at ggg.
Because in addition to those first two hoodies, you're gonna also find the Alpha Cruiser by Farpoint outdoor gear. 95 bucks, people.
Whether you're an ultralight backpack or just an outdoor outdoorsy person who wants to see outdoor innovation at its best, you'll find something to love, Alpha or otherwise, when you head to the official gear shop of gear Abbey. GarageGrownGear.com oh, Colin. I feel soft and snuggly. We just bathed in a sea of Alpha.
Colin True
00:33:23.430 - 00:33:26.190
Yes. Do you feel the. The Alpha revolution yet?
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:26.190 - 00:33:26.710
Comfortable?
Colin True
00:33:26.710 - 00:33:32.310
Yeah, some. Eventually. Someday. What's going to come next, though? Because then when people are over Alpha, what will come next?
Shawnté Salabert
00:33:33.040 - 00:33:57.760
I don't know. I. I'm thinking some sort of invisible fabric. We're just gonna go ultra, ultra light. Emperor's new clothes here Yeah, a little emperor's new clothes.
Maybe just like little pasties. It's gonna be like pasties and a little merkin. That's. There's nothing more ultralight than that. Unless you are actually naked. Okay, so Alpha merkin.
I want you guys to think about it. Maybe this is something for Sam Bob to get into, you know. Thoughts?
Colin True
00:33:57.760 - 00:34:07.340
I'm just pleased you said merkin. That's an underutilized word. And if it helps, merkin's like, you know, SEO or mentioning it on this podcast. You know, I'm pro merkin. So let's go.
Shawnté Salabert
00:34:07.340 - 00:34:12.620
I want to know. I want to know if people are googling merkin after listening to this episode. I really hope they are.
Colin True
00:34:12.620 - 00:34:18.220
Yeah, we should not tell them what a merkin is. Let's just go figure it out on your own. You'll be. You'll be shocked and delighted.
Shawnté Salabert
00:34:18.620 - 00:34:23.980
That's right. Ah. All right, well, shock and delight us with the final question for today's episode.
Colin True
00:34:24.620 - 00:34:37.210
Okay, last question of the day. Dear Gear Abby, I'm a big proponent of growing one's knowledge and furthering one's education in the job or career that they find themselves in.
Then it's a little academic kind of question to close out the show.
Shawnté Salabert
00:34:37.210 - 00:34:41.130
Is this the. Is this the. The guy who was writing looking for a job?
Colin True
00:34:41.610 - 00:34:49.290
Oh yeah, he's back and I don't think so, but it could be. It may different name. In working for REI for the last 11 years, that continued education.
Shawnté Salabert
00:34:49.530 - 00:34:50.570
Not him, not him.
Colin True
00:34:50.570 - 00:35:36.250
Was usually provided by attending the co op's in house experiential training events or etes.
A district wide gathering of representative representative employees from each store in our district to learn and be trained in new product from product reps in the industry history. However, with REI scaling back on or discontinuing those events altogether. Shame on you rei. You should not do that. And with their frequent.
With your frequent podcast conversations about your recent trade show attendances, I have come down with a serious case of fomo.
My question is, if myself and a few of my co workers were interested in attending the next Switchback trade show in New Orleans on our own dime, would we be gaining some useful knowledge or just crashing the party? Sincerely, trade booth barging Boris.
Shawnté Salabert
00:35:38.330 - 00:36:12.870
Well, listen, I. Who says you can't do both? Party hardy Boris. Seriously. So for people. I just.
For people who aren't super familiar, we have mentioned trade shows on here. We went to the running event back in December. For people who aren't familiar, they.
These are places simply where folks come from A specific industry Here we got outdoor or running. They come together to conduct business, learn, make connections.
It's also where people go to maybe pet and alpaca, pretend to be deeply interested in performance fabrics and shoestack heights, drink beer out of metal pint glasses and get a free, you know, bunch of free stuff. Or at least try to. So that's trade shows.
Colin True
00:36:12.870 - 00:36:13.190
Yes.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:13.750 - 00:36:21.430
I've been to my fair share as a journalist and I guess recently as a podcaster, Colin has been more to more than God himself.
Colin True
00:36:22.550 - 00:36:26.790
Are you saying that a journalist is not a podcaster, is not a journalist? What do we, you know, I don't know.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:27.110 - 00:36:32.020
We're doing some hard hitting elk sex journalism on this podcast. Talking about footsteps.
Colin True
00:36:32.020 - 00:36:33.580
I don't hear anyone else talking about it.
Shawnté Salabert
00:36:33.660 - 00:38:16.350
That's right. That's right. This is the only pod where you'll hear this hard hitting journalism.
But anyway, I'd say, you know, Colin and I have our, our varied experiences there and. But my number one advice, you know, for trade shows is know what you want to get out of them and then do your best to make that happen. Okay.
While still leaving a little room for magic. We'll get to that in a second. So, Boris, you sounds like you want to deepen your knowledge. Basically, space. Okay.
Since REI has punted the ball on that, trade shows generally offer a few ways to do that.
So between product demos, meeting with, you know, PR reps and brand folks, listening to speakers, and the educational sessions that are actually dedicated to that.
On that latter note, thinking back to last year's Switchback spring, they did really push the idea that the event wasn't just for sales, it was for networking and education.
So there were a bunch of sessions, especially that first day when the trade show floor wasn't even open and they dug into topics that could, could, I think, feel relevant for somebody on the retail side of things. I mean, that's kind of the point. I do think it's a little skewed to somebody on the retail buyer side of things. It doesn't.
Maybe you're not doing that. So it's things like working with emerging brands, using, you know, using data to drive growth, improving relationships with vendors.
But I do think there were enough general sessions and speakers that kind of talked about the state of the industry, the future of outdoor retail, you know, leaders, trends, that sort of thing. I also think there's a lot of value in attending when they have panel style sessions.
So for Switchback, that was their Trailheads theater where, you know, there were sessions on brand Storytelling, outdoor advocacy, sustainability, youth in the outdoors, size inclusivity, merchandising, all that kind of stuff. There was also the Rock Fight, Rip Collins old podcast.
Colin True
00:38:16.350 - 00:38:19.030
I heard it went out at the top of its game. I heard.
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:19.030 - 00:38:29.170
That's what I heard about it. Yeah, it's weird. That's not what I heard.
You know how many emails, by the way, I've gotten from people who are like, hey, why did you guys, like, why they're emailing me? Whose podcast?
Colin True
00:38:29.170 - 00:38:30.690
I haven't gotten these emails.
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:30.770 - 00:38:36.690
I've gotten so many. I should just forward them all to you. I'm like, why? It's like people are embarrassed to ask you why the hell you did what you did.
Colin True
00:38:36.770 - 00:38:39.010
That's right. You'll never know.
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:40.370 - 00:38:57.990
And it's because he believes in the future of gear, that's why. That's right. Also that he's got children to feed.
We already said this, and we don't know if the foot stuff, you know, is going to work on the only fans. So, yeah, I also. Okay, going back to trade shows, which is what Boris has asked us about.
Colin True
00:38:57.990 - 00:38:58.750
Thank you, Boris.
Shawnté Salabert
00:38:59.550 - 00:39:48.730
Sorry, Boris. I do think they're worth it. Beyond just focusing on education, and this is kind of the magic I mentioned earlier.
There are a lot of relationships and ideas in this industry that began while walking the aisles and attending parties and activations and other events related to the show. Going to the trade shows is actually how I broke out as an outdoor writer journalist before my book was, you know, my first book was ever published.
I connected with brands I eventually started writing copy for. I met editors that gave me a chance, you know, after pitching them to start writing for the magazines.
And I actually made friends that I still talk to and love to this day. So it's, I think it's a, you know, a fun thing all around. I mean, you're asking about investing your own money in this.
So I think taking all of that in and then whatever the hell Colin's about to say, that should help you sort of decide whether or not it's worth it. So, Colin, should they go?
Colin True
00:39:49.050 - 00:40:33.050
Yeah, I mean, I think if you are worked in the industry and you want to continue to work in the industry, then, yeah, if you can. I think the, yeah, the, the.
The challenge might be getting a badge, you know, because it's like, you can't just be an individual who wants to attend the show. You need to be. It's a trade show that you need to be with a organization that is part of the trade of the industry.
So probably you Know, if anyone at Switchback hears this and they get mad, we can take it out after the fact. Now, you know what? You don't run this podcast. I'm going to say what I want. You know what?
If you register as media and start a substack, that's probably the easiest way to get a badge. They will vet you. So you can't just. Just, like, make sure you have a few articles up. But even so, they might deny you.
The PR team there might say, nay, you are not allowed to come. But it's not.
Shawnté Salabert
00:40:33.050 - 00:40:37.650
Do you get this idea from Gear Abby, from Collins, specifically, I would like to mention.
Colin True
00:40:38.690 - 00:41:00.290
No, no, no. But that would be your biggest hurdle, probably, is getting into the show.
But I do think if, if, if you want to go around, talk to the brands, learn what they have coming up, understand the broader world, all the things that Shantae just said. Yeah, for sure. I mean, but it is, you know, make sure that you really want to go because, you know, it's a.
It's a plane ticket to New Orleans and a hotel in New Orleans in June, in the summertime.
Shawnté Salabert
00:41:00.290 - 00:41:01.090
In June in New Orleans.
Colin True
00:41:01.090 - 00:41:09.130
Yeah. So there's definitely, there's definitely a benefit to going, but like Shantae said, make sure you really know why you want to go.
Shawnté Salabert
00:41:09.130 - 00:41:57.070
I think we'll leave it at that. Colin, I think that was some solid advice. If you do go, send us an email. Maybe we'll be there. I don't know yet.
All right, that's it for this episode of Gear Abby.
Until next time, send your burning questions about relationship relationships with outdoor people, products, places and pastimes, and, I guess, trade shows over to DearGearAbbyMail.com I'm gonna do my best to answer them or find someone else who can. And of course, head over to your podcast listening service of choice and subscribe, rate and review to support the pod and make my day.
Maybe Collins too. I don't know. Follow us on Instagram at gearabypod if you want. In the meantime, today's episode was produced by David Car Karstad and this guy.
Art direction provided by Sarah Gensert. I'm Shantay Salibara. And remember, there are no dumb questions, just smart advice. You.
Colin True
00:41:59.870 - 00:42:01.150
I'm leaving that in.
