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A Canadian Grizzly Attack, Columbia Attempts To Make A New Outdoor Category & A Cheater In Wales


Welcome back to THE ROCK FIGHT, an outdoor podcast that aims for the head.


Today Colin & Justin dig into recent headlines to come out of the outdoor industry and community including the recent theft of a shipment of Bedrock Mountain Clogs, Columbia trying to make Overlanding shoes a thing, a deadly grizzly attack in Canada and the runner who tried to cheat their way to a 21st place finish at a half marathon in Wales.

  • Tales From The Trail/Bedrock Stolen Clogs: 2:07

  • Columbia's Landroamer Launch: 10:41

  • Canadian Grizzly Attack: 20:48

  • Half Marathon Cheating Scandal: 29:03

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FULL TRANSCRIPT

(automatically generated so if there are mistakes take it up with Skynet)


Colin (00:06):

Welcome to the rock fight where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows sometimes Agree to disagree. I'm Colin. True and joining me today, he has some bedrock sandals he can get you for a great deal. It's Justin Hausman. Justin (00:21): I don't know if you read my latest AJ newsletter, but I talk about how charmed I was that bedrock is like, you know what? Don't buy any right now, just give us a month. And how cool is that? I was like, totally cool. And I have to imagine that most people that would get that message from them somehow would be like, oh yes, absolutely. It made me feel good about the outdoor community. That's like for the most part, you can rely on us to not be total shitheads and be like, Ooh, I don't know though. It's like 50% off. I get it on eBay. Colin (00:52): Just do the right thing, Justin (00:53): Folks. Colin (00:53): Yeah. Well, we're talking a little bit about Bedrock. We're going to talk a little bit more about that in a second. We're going to talk a little bit about what's happening in the outdoor world. Before we get to that though, hey Justin, congratulations making it to the weekend. It's Saturday when we're recording this, you got any plans for the weekend? Is it going to be a long weekend? Justin (01:10): What are the weekend plans? Well, the It's Fleet week up here and I'm the only progressive liberal in San Francisco Bay area that loves when the jets and the ships come into town. I was Colin (01:23): Surfing Justin (01:23): Yesterday and the parade of ships comes through the Golden Gate and it's pretty rad if you're surfing kind the north end of the beach and you just have this lineup of destroyers and cruisers and stuff like cruising in through the Golden Gate. That's cool. So Colin (01:38): Those things should always be cool Justin (01:39): No matter what they're, I'm taking the four year old to go see the Blue Angels in the F 35 demonstration this afternoon. Colin (01:44): Well, I started my weekend, I do any other day with a pot of long weekend secret handshake blend. Long Weekend coffee is the perfect pairing for your next adventure, whether it's seeing the long ships in San Francisco or going out for a gravel ride. So head to long weekend, do coffee shop around, add stuff to your cart, and then a checkout. Enter the promo code Rock 10 to get 10% off of your first order long weekend coffee. More weekend, please. All right, so let's just get caught up a little bit on what we've been doing outside. Have you had any fun adventures Justin (02:13): This week? I've been surfing again, Colin. I'm a surfer again. Colin (02:17): That been, has it been like, oh, I forgot how much fun this is just perfect waves. Is that what kind of got you back out there? What was the impetus there? It's been a while. Justin (02:26): Well, yeah, I mean it's the summer sucks here always right, but yeah, it's fall now, so it's offshore and the waves are fun. The water's warm. I mean, it's the best time of year for surfers in California, especially up here. Also, San Francisco was always where I surf was always notoriously empty of new surfers. It's really just a treacherous place to surf. The waves are huge and powerful a lot of the times, and it's not a beginner friendly zone. And so forever it was pretty much an undiscovered sort of country. You mean it was just tons of beach and you could go surf wherever you want. You'd barely Colin (03:03): See people for a while. There was the break du jour that you saw covered like, Hey, everyone's surfing the ocean beach. Everyone's going to San Francisco now. And I dunno if that was Mavericks, that kind spawned that or what, but Justin (03:13): A little bit. I mean, it's just honestly just more exposure with people with cameras and phones. I mean, same things happened everywhere, (03:20) But we got pretty slammed pretty hard in the last decade in terms of crowds, just younger dudes moving up here for the tech scene and people working more flexible hours and it got more, we've talked about it before. It got to the point where it was way more crowded than anything I ever saw in Southern California, which is bizarre considering the actual waves and the beach and stuff. But somehow in the last couple of years, I don't know if it's probably, well, I guess it's almost certainly because people are leaving San Francisco again, but the crowd scene has just fallen off the table, so it's just been a joy this week where you could just drive to the beach and it's pretty user-friendly in terms of the surf around here and there's hardly anybody out. I mean, it's been fantastic. That's Colin (04:04): Awesome. It's Justin (04:05): Been a good week. Been a real nice week. Yeah. What about you? Colin (04:08): I've not had much of a week. I had a tooth extracted on Tuesday because I had a failed root canal. Justin (04:13): That's an adventure. I Colin (04:14): Mean, it is kind of an adventure. It's an adventure of number one getting sedated and then it's an adventure. Number two of you got to sit around for two or three days so you don't get dry socket. So that's sucks. So I've not been doing much this week, which I'm kind of getting bummed. Our bike packing trip is a month from today. We'll be riding I feel like, so I want get out riding a little bit. I'm feeling the urge or the need to log some miles to be ready. I think our first day is going to be pretty burly, (04:40) But as I've been sitting around there was interesting. We mentioned in the open about bedrock. I mean, I can't remember the last time I heard they literally had a shipment of their clog stolen and it sounds like it was a targeted thing. You and I both. And it's the mountain clog too, which is their new shoe that we both reviewed here on the rock fight. And then it was funny, I had this on our outline to talk about and then yeah, you covered it in your AJ newsletter. So it's kind of, I don't know, a unique thing. We don't see too often here in the outdoor industry, I feel like, Justin (05:07): Well, I don't know. I think I read about it on Gear Junkie. I don't know. They mentioned something about a viral TikTok or something like that, which spawned at popularity for the shoes, and I haven't seen, I don't know what that's from. I don't know if they reached out to an influencer or something like that who made a video and it took off or what, but I didn't realize that they had grown so popular amongst the influencer crowd. I'm not surprised. I mean, they're pretty unusual shoes, but yeah, I'd like to think that it might have something to do with something that we've talked about or written. Maybe that was what spawned their popularity. Not the theft, I mean, but the popularity of the shoes. Colin (05:50): Well, I found them because of your coverage in AJ a couple of years ago. That's when I first heard of Bedrock, which is funny. They've been around since 2011. And then you reviewed them on here and then I did a follow-up review for the Mountain clog and it's getting a beaten mountain clog season pretty soon, but Justin (06:05): I forgot I had them a couple, I don't know, a week ago I was kind of digging under my bed for some other shoes. I'm like, oh yeah, I forgot all about these, but I'm not quite ready to admit that it's going to be cold soon, so I put 'em right back. But Colin (06:19): It's funny though to think that if they're finding out about the theft through them showing up on eBay and Facebook marketplace and if there's some sort of viral thing happening on TikTok, it would be kind of funny to think that this could be something that helps them blow up as they had their shit stolen. Justin (06:32): Oh, it absolutely could. I was thinking about that too. I mean it totally could. Colin (06:36): That'd be awesome. I mean a nice silver lining to a bad situation. Justin (06:40): It's still a huge bummer. I mean, I don't know enough about theft. Their sort of, well, yeah, how do you do it? I don't know enough about their market share or financial situation to know whether or not I don't lose a season's worth of shoes. Are you screwed? I mean, I don't know. A friend of mine who owns this, I've talked to him before, but he owns a wetsuit company. They had a manufacturing snafu where the manufacturer decided to use a different glue to glue the seams together and didn't tell them or glue the tape onto the seams. It didn't say anything, and it turns out that the glue will work. And so they had an entire season of suits that just failed and they were like, we don't know if we're going to be around next year. We don't know. We might not be able to survive this. And they ended up being fine. So hopefully Bedrock is the same, Colin (07:26): And we talk a lot about this on this show and usually from a cynical point of view, but if you ever wonder why cool independent brands who get known based off of cool products sell out to VF or Vista Outdoors or Columbia or whatever, this is why, because it's a really good point. I mean you think about Bedrock has what eight products total in their line. The mountain clog was this kind of big initiative for them to kind like, Hey, we're expanding the line, and they sold out their first thing. I couldn't get it. Remember when we first did the review earlier this year, I couldn't even get a pair. But still, how much then did they invest in this line and then to not have the product show up that could totally kill the brand depending on where their financials are. I mean if they're treading water. Absolutely. So this is where it starts to look pretty attractive, where it's like VF comes knocking like, Hey, we want to acquire you, so we're going to write you a big fat check and you won't have zero per issues like this ever again because we're vf. That's where it makes sense, right? Justin (08:28): It does. And I was thinking about it. I got to assume that there is, oh man, I would love to go undercover and write about this sort of thing, but I have to assume that theft rings for this sort of stuff around here. Well, around everywhere, there's a big rash of car break-ins right now and it's not like one dude going around and breaking into cars and see if they have phones. It's like they get paid to do it by somebody else who sells all the stuff they steal on eBay, right? They're organized rings. Colin (08:56): Right. Justin (08:56): So Colin (08:57): It's like aggressive panhandling. Justin (08:58): Yeah, I sort of have to assume this is probably something similar. When I was writing about it, I was imagining, I don't know what the situation was. I think it was a truck that they like. I don't dunno if they stole the whole truck, they just stole the, who knows how it went. But I'm imagining these dudes in ski masks or whatever busting open this truck and they're all hyped up on it. They're all whatever it is, full nerves and stuff as they're committing this crime and they bust open the back and they're see all these boxes, boxers like these fucking dorky shoes. This is we're the cops can come any second these shoes. This is what we're stealing. I love that Colin (09:42): You wrote something similar to that in your AJ newsletter. You, did you say something about that Justin (09:48): Video? Yeah, it's got to be the first time. There's been some big organized stuff ring about clogs. Colin (09:54): That's right. Justin (09:55): But yeah, Colin (09:55): Because you wrote that and as I read it, I'm like, I had this picture of the scene in Goodfellas when they boost the truck in the beginning and they're selling the cigarettes or whatever or selling whatever out of the back of the car and I'd be like, there's Henry Hill and fucking Tommy, they're slick suits, but then they got on Mountain clogs smokey's like what you got to do? You were selling these fucking clogs. Now's just totally, Justin (10:16): Totally cigarettes. And I think they do that with beef or something too in Goodfellows. Yeah, the idea that they're just like, well, it's Colin (10:25): Like a SCORs Scorsese made an outdoor themed movie. It's Justin (10:27): Amazing. And I actually meant to go on eBay to see what the story was with the clogs. They're probably calling 'em the weirdest shit too, whoever's leather clog, shoe sandals. Colin (10:41): Let's get in the headlines. The first one you sent me, this one today, this week, and this is the, not to get off on kind of a negative foot here folks, but this is just buckle up for this one because Columbia, we mentioned Columbia a little bit ago, but Columbia has announced their overland shoes and apparel line. They released a collection of these shoes, they're calling Land R. Its being marketed towards the Overland community. The collection consists of a waterproof leather boot, a Chelsea boot, and a slip-on that looks remarkably similar to the Merrill Jungle Mock. The justification for the line is pretty thin. Even in an interview, Columbia product manager Ryan Bucci gave to Gear Junkie. They claim what that when combined with the Land Roma apparel line, it offers consumers a head to toe option for adventuring by car, truck, van, or other rigs in short, the same as all other apparel and footwear. So you sent this to me. I learned about it from you. What do you think of the overlanding specific line from Columbia? Justin (11:39): I didn't watch the interview, I didn't read anything about it. I did go to the website to try and see if they were going to actually try to justify this in some way, and to their credit, they don't. I honestly thought there might be a picture of someone's foot on a Sprinter gas pedal with their shoe and it's showing how it relieves strain on the forefoot as you're driving all day or some insane shit like that, but it's bad enough to where I looked around at my closet and I was like, what does Columbia own that they've basically anything I have here is Mountain Hardware is Columbia, so I might just get rid of all this. I was that offended where I've thought about purging my closet from Mountain Hardware stuff. I mean, Colin (12:21): Which is funny too. Hardware did a brand relaunch this week and it's awesome. It is exactly what you did you see there, new website and everything. It's cool. It makes him look super Justin (12:31): Cool again. Well, that's good, but Jesus, holy Christ, Columbia, I mean, I don't really know what to say. I don't know what to say. How did that get past? I mean whatever. You know what? People will buy it. I live in Sprinter Town, so people will buy it. I'll see this shit. I'll see, but the boots are just boots. I mean Colin (12:49): They're just Justin (12:50): Boots. But even I would actually have preferred that they really went all in and they're like, these are like F one racing shoe inspired, whatever. Cool. At least you're trying, but Colin (13:02): For your rv, I mean for Justin (13:04): The love of Christ, man, wow. Wow. Colin (13:08): This is where are the checks and balances by the outdoor media. I mean this is why we rant a lot in this pod, but it's like this is why, I mean, how is no one sitting in that media day with these people and going, really, or Gear Junkie write a snarky coverage article about this, right? Hey, yeah, overlanding shoes, your new balance won't work. Justin (13:36): That's why it helps that we don't make any money from this second Columbia cuts a check. Those are going to be the coolest shoes we've ever seen in our lives. You kidding? That's Colin (13:44): Why they'll never sponsor this podcast if we're going after beer companies first. Justin (13:48): I mean, that's it, man. I mean that's it Colin (13:51): Mean you just nailed, that's the answer to my question, right? I mean, it's kind of like everybody is too in bed with the outdoor brands and nobody wants to hurt any feelings or say anything overly negative and to your point, the stuff will work fine. I'm sure they'll probably fit great. They're probably made in the same factories as every other performance footwear brand in the world, but it's just, I mean, come on. We talk about, I'm giving RAB and outdoor research shit for going to an obviously adjacent market for them in mountain biking and you're telling me you had no other things to do, but make overlanding shoes and apparel appar. What is Overland Apparel? What does technical overland apparel do? Justin (14:28): Well, what's interesting is you have to wonder if this exact conversation took place when whoever pitched that idea pitched it and they decided to just do it anyway because surely there were people, I mean, here's the thing with these brands, they're staffed by people who are probably pretty cool and smart and it's like what are they going to do? Quit over a dumb idea? No, of course not. They're going to like, well, all right, I guess this is what we're doing. And I'm sure a lot of them are like, this is ridiculous. But Colin (14:56): So in my experience sitting in some of those rooms like selling textiles, you're absolutely right. There's definitely some places where you see the eyebrows raise or you get the like, all right, so yeah, we're going to do this line and what do you got for this? And you're kind of like, well, we have this fabric I guess that will work for your weird thing that you're doing. There's other places though, where they're absolutely just completely indoctrinated and they've drunk the Kool-Aid and they're like, no, no. Our market research shows that the overlanding market is going to need its own specific set of things, and this could be a real winner for us, and this is just a weird one to me. The mountain bike one makes sense. That really does make sense. I think there's a layer of criticism that is valid there, but I understand why a brand like Outdoor Research or RAB would expand into that category. Loa making trail runner running shoes. I get it. This is just a weird category. I mean, it's a category where you can wear Wrangler jeans and the t-shirt from the concert you went to Justin (15:54): 30 years. I don't even usually wear shoes while I'm driving, to be honest with you. Colin (15:58): Yeah, they're in the truck, but you're not. Justin (16:00): If I'm going on a really long trip and it's warm out, I drive barefoot a lot of time. I drive barefoot every time I come back from the beach. I mean, it's like I'm not wearing a shirt half the time I'm driving in the mountains. I mean, Colin (16:12): Jesus, my kids, if they saw me driving in shoes, they'd be surprised. So if you're over landing, yeah, I understand. Maybe you have to get out if you're on a trail or someplace, you're back somewhere where you want to kind of scout the road ahead, but then you just put your shoes on. I don't know, man. Justin (16:28): I love that the shoe's called a Land Roma too. I was thinking a little bit about this because there's already a garishly awful environmentally destroying line of Overland Griggs called the Earth Roma, and these are like $500,000, 12,000 pound RVs with insane four wheel drive capabilities. This is the thing you think these San Diego County and Marin County sprinter guys have a lot of money to burn. These are the things that people ship in containers around the world. Colin (17:02): What West Seiler thinks everybody should drive, Justin (17:04): Right? I'm going to go to Namibia, so I'm going to ship my earth roamer on a tank on a freighter from my house in Laguna Beach. I mean, this is a real Colin (17:15): Thing. Could use some fossil fuels right there. Justin (17:16): And so it's like, is the Land R name like a nod to the Earth Roma vehicle? Is it? Colin (17:24): Oh man. Like I said, my big beef is look, they got to make stuff. They got to expand lines. Ultimately it's capitalist society, all that stuff. I really wish that, because I read it in Gear Junkie too, I just wish River wrote that article would've just kind of had a little bit more of a really kind of a question eyebrow raised with their coverage of it. They can't because Justin (17:42): They can't. They Colin (17:42): Can't. They can't. But I also think you can have some journalistic integrity and just sort of let the statement from the person, you kind of get it across like, Hey, we pressed them on the need for this and this is what they Justin (17:54): Said. I agree. And I wish if I were to start my own sort of media brand, that's what I would just be like, look, here's the deal. You're going to brands, generally speaking, this hopefully will get really popular. So any publicity is good publicity. I'm just going to say what I think and get on board. Who caress if I don't like your stuff, does it matter to you? I'm clearly not your target, so worry about your target. I think that would be great. I would love for big media, for some big outdoor media to just be like, I'm not afraid to step on people's toes or to shit on things because we're doing a good job and we're being honest and people listen to us. It's thin skin. There you Colin (18:33): Go. It's completely thin skin I think because number one, I think what choice do the brands have? They're going to continue to advertise and I don't know. I look at, and I always, movies are my default comparison, which isn't really, it's not a one for one comparison, but I don't know, people continue to think about what goes into making something like a movie and then you have it comes out and then one guy with some notoriety goes to see it. It's like, ah, this is shit. And then nobody goes to see it. And that's art, right? I mean, I get it, but it's also so it should be you had a bad review, somebody questions it. Well, don't you want that critical feedback? That's a little, Justin (19:06): That's true. If Colin (19:07): You were just being told you're great all the time, energy's going to get complacent anyway. I don't know. I just feel like the media needs to do better. Justin (19:13): That's true. Plus at least a handful of people, if not more, are going to go to the website and click on this to see, I got to see these fucking shoes now based on us talking about it. That's true too. And one of them will buy them Colin (19:25): At least Justin (19:26): One person. You're welcome, Columbia. One person who did not know about this otherwise is going to buy them based on this conversation. I guarantee Colin (19:34): It. Also, how much sway do you feel like Gear Junkie or the rock fight or outside magazine, whoever has over people. Crocs is the best example, and I'm not taking a shot just for taking a shot. Justin (19:43): Very good example. Colin (19:44): Crocs are objectively dumb and ugly looking, but they're comfortable as shit, right? So people were like, yeah, I like that. It is just like they are, what do we say, 5 billion, 7 billion now? And I guarantee you everyone thought they were stupid when they came out. Why? Because I was there and we all said those are stupid. It's just Justin (20:06): I've mentioned before, I do some copywriting for Keen and I think it's absolutely brilliant that their Newport sandal, which is insanely comfortable and awesome in one of my favorite pairs of shoes, is marketed as the world's ugliest sandal That's Colin (20:18): Lean into it. Fucking Justin (20:19): Brilliant. That's great. Colin (20:21): Be who you are. Yeah, well, there you go. We'll send you an invoice, Columbia, for all that good brand and media advice from Maybe that's what we Justin (20:29): Start consulting Colin (20:30): Side of the business. Justin (20:31): You know what we think we're so smart. Colin (20:33): We do. Justin (20:34): We fell for it. Hook, line and sinker. Colin (20:36): Fuck, Justin (20:37): This is the whole point. Colin (20:41): Columbia. Columbia, I just complimented Mountain Hardware's website who's owned by Columbia. Well, played well. Our next headline comes from Report on explorers web.com, who reported on October 1st about the grim story of a parrot backpackers who were killed by a grizzly bear in Canada's band of National Park. A husband and wife duo along with their dog were experienced backpackers, and all three were victims of a bear who authorities described as aggressive and was found and destroyed shortly after the attack. This is the time of year when bears are fattening up for winter, and it's also the time of year when northern climates get the best weather for backpacking. So I don't know, man. I never know what to do make of these stories. I devour them. Sorry, no pun intended, voraciously when they come out. I always read them when they do come out, but as someone who backpacks more than I do, what goes through your mind when you hear about an incident like this? Justin (21:34): Well, Jesus, man. I mean, have you ever been killed and eaten by a bear, Colin? Colin (21:39): I have not. And you hear the survival stories and it sounds like not a great way to go out. Justin (21:48): I don't camp in those places. I mean, that's actually a, I don't know how big it is, hopefully small. There is a movement within California to reintroduce grizzly bears to the Sierra, and I will literally chain myself to any kind of thing that would keep that from happening. I've been to Montana a lot. We used to go there a lot to do some really epic mountainous horseback riding, and I was in very much grizzly country Colin (22:17): And Justin (22:17): I have fished in places in Montana where people have been eaten on that spot or at least killed. And I found that out in retrospect, and I was horrified that I was being so idiotic fishing by myself in those places. So I respect that those things are there. I don't think that we should kill grizzly bears or whatever, but I guess I would imagine that those people will probably tell you. Well, they knew that. They knew the risks. I mean, there was a guy killed and eaten by a great white over in point Reyes, which is pretty close to me. I've been to the beach before where he was killed. I've never surfed there, but I've thought about it and I mean, if that happened to me, I've was surfing all week. If that happened to me, I wouldn't complain. I'd be like, well, I guess I knew that could happen, but I just think the articles I was reading were talked about how experienced these people were. Colin (23:13): Yeah, that's did be Justin (23:14): More than Colin (23:14): Everything else. Justin (23:16): And you're just like, well, shit. I probably wouldn't, I don't know. I mean, I'm cavalier about bears. We only have black bears in California, and although I believe statistically I could be wrong, I do believe that statistically if you're attacked by either a grizzly or a black bear, you're more likely to be killed eaten by a black bear. They are so rarely attack people. They only do it if they're hunting you. They don't really charge you and try to kill you. If they're cubs around, they're just going to bounce. But if a black bear is coming after you, it's intending on eating you. So I do think that. I believe I've read that before, but you see a bear around California, you're like, oh, sick. It's not. Colin (23:56): Yeah, right. It's a cool wilderness experience Justin (23:58): And I just can't fathom it, dude. I can't imagine putting myself in a place to where the idea of getting killed Newton by Grizzly is totally feasible. I just can't. Colin (24:10): Is there a difference as a surfer in your mind? There probably is not really a difference in terms of the risk of actually being a, statistics are still very low. I'm curious what the correlation is between bear attacks and shark attacks. But I mean, you're so much more comfortable in the water and a lot of people say, they say, oh, I'm not going to learn to surf. I'm afraid of sharks. And it's like, come on. But it's kind of the same thing ultimately, isn't it? When these happens, we talk about it because it is kind of a rare thing. Justin (24:38): I have to think there's been more shark attacks than bear attacks. I could be wrong. Well, I don't know. I don't know, actually. It'd be really easy to find out. But yeah, I mean it is similar and the thing that's hard though about surfing is that you can just not go where they did. And it's plenty, I mean, there's definitely times where in the wintertime, for example, we get a lot of runoff, which forms really good sandbars. And so there's a couple spots I like to surf up in Marin County that are purely based on, oh, good, there's been a lot of sand. So when you're surfing, it's like you can't see six inches into the water. Colin (25:15): It's Justin (25:15): So murky with sand, and that's one of the worst times to do it because sharks are even more confused about what's out there. And theoretically, if sharks know what you are, they're not going to try to hunt you and eat you. So it's when they can't see you well that they're more likely to get killed. Colin (25:31): And Justin (25:31): I'll still surf. I've been out before where the bloated body of a cow was floating nearby and just been like, oh, that's probably attracting some shit, but God, the sandbar iss insane. I'm not getting out. So it's like, Colin (25:45): I Justin (25:45): Don't know. I've done that too. So I guess, I don't dunno. I mean I'm sure these people feel the same way. They're aware. I've lived my entire life surfing in the red triangle of which is from Marin down to Marin, down to I guess probably San Luis Obispo County, which is the grizzly or the great white capital of North America. And I don't not surf. I still surf. So Colin (26:14): Yeah, I dunno. I'm curious about the phrasing they used in the article about it's an aggressive grizzly too, because what does that mean? There was a mountain lion attack just east of Seattle when we were still living up there a few years back, and it was an emaciated cat that it was a problem, and the mountain biker got killed, I'm pretty sure got killed. And when they found it like, oh yeah, this thing was just going to go after anybody, it was not doing the typical things usually. I mean, you and I probably both walked or run or bike by mountain lions that had no idea they were there. Just the odds are guaranteed unlikely, and this thing was aggressive. So I'm curious what that means. The aggressive bear, was it, especially with the, it's a combination of the aggressive bear with experienced backpackers like, well, what I'm curious of the encounter, I would almost want to know more because yeah, ultimately we can't be afraid of these sort of encounters otherwise we won't ever go do the things that we like to go do. Right? Justin (27:10): Yeah. I Colin (27:10): Mean even most shark attacks by all accounts are like they bite someone and they're like, oh, I don't want that, and they swim away and it's like rarely is it like, fuck yeah, I'm going to eat this. That doesn't really happen that often, and usually it's just unfounded fears based off of movies and stuff like that. So I don't know. I'm totally with you. At the same time, if someone who was a guide who was like, Hey, you should come up and go backpacking and Banff, I'd probably be like, that sounds spectacular. You wouldn't go No, you're you're shaking your head no, Justin (27:37): No, I know I wouldn't. I've had that opportunity in Banff. I've had that opportunity in Montana and I tell you right now, what Colin (27:45): About Alaska? Same thing. Nope. Nope. No kidding. Justin (27:49): Unless it was somewhere where there's really not any grizzly bears around here, but in a place where there's bears around, no, I wouldn't enjoy it and I am sitting here thinking about it and I can't explain to you how that's possibly different than surfing. I don't know. I mean, I've surfed places in Hawaii that are super notoriously like Tiger Shark inhabited tiger sharks are way more aggressive than great whites. I don't know if it's something, I feel like with the shark attack it's more like you can't see it for the most part. It's just going to be like a boom. It's got you, and then you either live or you die. A bear thing to me seems so much more terrifying. Like they're stalking you, you're aware of it. It's not like an instantaneous thing from below that you can't see. If I get eaten by a shark, I can't imagine this's got to be fucking horrifying, but it's going to be over fast, a grizzly bear attack, holy crap. I don't know. That to me just scares the living shit out of me. And there's other places I can go that are going to look similar enough Colin (28:49): Condolences to the families. It's one of these, this is definitely one of those things that we don't like to think about, but every few months, year or so always seems to crop up and definitely makes you kind of evaluate your choices I guess when you're going outside. Our next topic is in the running world where runner Sean Daniels, I had to actually Google pronunciation because that's s I o n, because he Welch was seen at the finish line of the Cardiff Half Marathon, which also got my ex as a Cardiff here in San Diego. So I'm like, oh, was this locally? No, it's Cardus over in Wales. Justin (29:19): No, the Colin (29:19): Real Cardiff. The Real Cardiff, which is the largest participation event in Wales and raises 3 million pounds for charity every October. He was seen celebrating a time of the half marathon of 1 0 7 and 40 seconds, which would've gotten him 21st place. But organizers said he removed his chip and submitted a false G p s recorded file of the 2022 edition of the race. So the course matched the 2022 race, not the current one. Daniels was seen at the halfway point very far behind the leaders and concerns were raised when he was celebrating at the finish, given where he was seen at the halfway point, he would've had to run a world record pace for the final seven miles to get the time he claimed, which apparently he was not capable of when looking at his previous race times. This just was confounding to me. What possible low point do you need to be in your life to think about lying about your half marathon time? Justin (30:11): I don't in any way have a justification for what I'm about to say, but I love it. I am fascinated by this kind of thing, and I love reading stories about where someone just showed up halfway through the race from the front and everyone's like, well, you obviously didn't run until the end or whatever. This happens a lot. I feel like you sort of regional races, Colin (30:35): Especially in 2023 where there's video cameras everywhere and people filming. Justin (30:40): I love it. I can't explain it. There's an amazing book and I don't know what it's called, but the paraphrasing of the title is Great Adventure Hoaxes and there's maybe eight or so stories of people Colin (30:55): That think Rosie were Louis in there, the Boston Marathon and stuff like that, or Justin (30:59): No, this is more exploration type things where someone big time, they said they went to a place and they didn't. I'm just fascinated by the people that are able, do they think they want? Does he think he won? Colin (31:15): Are these Justin (31:15): People insane? He's Colin (31:16): Claiming to win be 21st. It wasn't even like I won the race. Justin (31:20): Okay, I glossed over that part. Amazing. It doesn't matter. That's the thing is either way it Colin (31:26): Really doesn't matter. Justin (31:27): That's true. He ran the whole race. I don't know. I love the Moxie. I don't know. I hate cheating in sports, generally speaking, I think all steroid users should be kicked out of the Hall of Fame and I think the Astros should vacate their 2017 World Series title and all these sorts of things. But when it comes to some Welsh dude who's just like, I could have cheated this marathon. I love the Boxy. I can't explain it. I Colin (31:51): Think it's cool. I would love to wrap this guy in Wonder Woman's lasso of truth and just be like, come on man, tell me what's up, what's up? What is going on with you? It had to have been a bat, Justin (32:01): Had to have been a batt. He bet somebody he could finish. Colin (32:04): The backstory's going to be, it could be sad, but it's going to be great no matter what it is. If it was just like, Hey man, I was at a low point. I just wanted to go for it and see if I could get away with it or yeah, my buddy said I couldn't do this. Whatever. This is a movie. This is not something that actually happens in real life. You know what I mean? This is amazing. Justin (32:23): There was a kind of a big story, and I don't remember, I think it was in the New York Times, but I don't remember what series of events it was where somebody had been clearly fabricated. Well, it took a long time before anybody figured it out, but some guy had been, I think it was the guy, it could have been a woman. No know what. I think he was winning. I think it was a guy, I think he was like a dentist or something. It's coming back to me and I think he was winning all these races and people finally started to put two and two together that they never saw him in the places where he should have been. And there was this big deep dive into his numbering system and it got really complicated where he was, he was leaving watches in different places or something, so there'd be little blips on his location device. They'd be like, well, oh, there he is. And it was like that's how he was sort of manipulating getting to certain places in the race, but it was a big controversy and I was like, that's so interesting. That's way more interesting to me than someone who wins Every race has ever been run under the best runner in the world who gives a shit, but this guy who spent all this time figuring out how to cheat and win at it, that to me, I'd listen to a podcast about that. That's awesome. Colin (33:25): Me too. No, almost. I want to think that there's some vast conspiracy of people who are just trying to get away with this, especially in modern age where we do have so much technology capturing all of our movements. Rosie Ruiz, one reason why she got, I think caught, I believe there was footage for getting on the, the subway system in Boston. Justin (33:41): I remember that in Colin (33:42): The middle of the race, I remember that. And that was in that the seventies or eighties or something. I mean it was before there was cameras everywhere, right? Love, I love that. So imagine trying to get away with this today. So I love the idea of these guys are like, all right man, I'm going to go for it in Cardiff this year. We're fun to do. Justin (33:59): It's fucking funny. Absolutely. If I was running a race, I entered a marathon, which there's no way in hell I could even finish a half marathon. Colin (34:08): I love that I Justin (34:09): Enter a marathon, I'd be like, I get a cheat Colin (34:12): And I'm like three miles in or whatever, Justin (34:14): And I'm like, all right, and I'm just sprinting off and kind of pulling over for a Colin (34:18): Rest or whatever. Maybe try the little local where you have a hundred runners or something. Because the giant biggest event in whales, I feel like even with more participants, you're more likely to get caught. There's just more attention on it Justin (34:33): And he probably, Colin (34:34): I hope we get more a follow-up story of this. You've got to think that maybe he thought out, well, I'll finish like 21st. No one will notice if I'm in the twenties, if I win, they'll know. Justin (34:47): That's part of it too. I mean if someone's losing money from it, that's bad. If you're taking someone's prize check away. I don't like that. But just generally speaking, I find it really funny. Colin (34:58): I think much like the bedrock thing, I think this is going to generate such good PR probably for the event, right? Because people are going to be sympathetic to the event and be like, fuck this guy who's trying to cheat at the charity event. You know what I mean? I think if anything, the event's going to benefit from it over time. I would think. I didn't know about the Cardiff half marathon before this happened. Justin (35:19): I'm also generally not a competitive person, so I don't really care. Well, in some ways. I mean I want the Dodgers to win at all costs. So I guess in some ways I'm kind of competitive, but not directly so not directly. So if you and I are going to do not care, for example, who rides faster on a bike Colin (35:36): And I never would, Justin (35:37): That kind of shit doesn't matter. I've entered one bike race, at no point was I like, I got to pass this person next to me. It didn't even enter my head. So it's different. I don't care who wins or loses. Colin (35:49): Yeah, we need Grand Fondo for every event because even when I was doing, I never entered a race thinking I'm going to win this, but I also was like, it would get in my head then if I was feeling bad during the race. Like fuck is a race and I suck and I'm not going to, versus like, Hey, it's a great, who cares? We're here. It takes you 10 hours to run 13 miles and who caress? I think that's a healthier way to approach these things, for sure. Alright man, well we can wrap it up there, but first before we do some tough love for our listeners, the rock fight is a slave to the God of algorithms. So when we ask you to subscribe and rate the show, we try to be nice about it, but even if you were modestly entertained today, and I don't know how you can only be modestly entertained by this show, please subscribe and rate the show five stars. I mean, ask yourself, what would Tacoma Phil do? I assume that he's followed and given us five stars. He's our biggest fan, right? Justin (36:33): Can we find out, Colin (36:34): Phil, right in, have you subscribed to the podcast? If anyone has subscribed, it's Phil. I believe in you. Phil, before we sign off though, you got anything to plug? You got your AJ newsletter. AJ's got a new podcast. We can hear you in other places now. Justin (36:47): Oh yeah, that's right. Yeah. The first one comes out next week. Well, I don't know when this is dropping, but today's Saturday, October 7th. I can't remember when the first AJ one is released, but it will be next week. So by the time you hear this, it will be out there and available. Colin (36:59): The Adventure Earn podcast. Yeah, check it out. Justin (37:01): The Adventure podcast. Different vibe than the Rock Fight podcast. So if you want a little bit more of less swearing and less me making fun of people, Colin (37:12): No, I got a sneak preview of it. It is quite good. So please everybody, make sure you subscribe and listen also to AJ's podcast. That's awesome. And then you get more houseman in your life who doesn't need more houseman in your life. But we'll be back soon with more outdoor ideas that aim for your head, the rock fights production rock fight L l C for Justin Hausman. I'm Colin True. Thanks for listening here as always to take us out as Krista makes From Less Than Jake with the Rock Fight Fight song. We'll see you next time. Rock fighters

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