What Does Stoke Footwear Mean For The Outdoor Industry?

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Today on The Rock Fight Colin, Eoin Comerford and Producer Dave talk about some recent headlines to come out of the outdoor industry including recent comments made by some of the industry's more notable CEO's.

For the Lightning Round they do quick hits on J Crew, JD Sports, and OR's new athlete team.

Then they unpack the launch of Stoke Footwear, a running-inspired shoe brand built for “real American men” that’s already landed in hundreds of retail doors. Is this smart retail validation, or another case of active heritage being repackaged for a different audience?

Lastly for The Parting Shot, Colin takes aim at the promotion of Alex Honnold's next big thing.

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Episode Transcript:

Chris DeMakes

00:00:00.080 - 00:00:08.160

Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Rock Fight. Here we go.

Colin True

00:00:08.400 - 00:00:27.360

Welcome to the Rock Fight, where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows, and sometimes agree to disagree. This is an outdoor podcast that aims for the head.

I'm Colin True, and joining me today, be sure to check out Netflix this weekend to catch their new special where they'll be climbing a flight of stairs at the mall on their way to check out a footlocker. It's Owen Comerford and producer Dave.

Producer Dave

00:00:27.980 - 00:00:28.300

That's right.

Colin True

00:00:28.300 - 00:00:29.140

Can't wait for it, guys.

Eoin Comerford

00:00:29.140 - 00:00:33.140

That's right, I'm escalator only, Colin. I'm not climbing.

Colin True

00:00:33.140 - 00:00:37.180

As Mitch Hedberg says, an escalator can never break because it just turns into stairs.

Producer Dave

00:00:38.060 - 00:00:50.140

Well, vertical limit 2 electric boogaloo is what we're. Yes, yes, yes. Or the elevator is out.

Colin True

00:00:50.700 - 00:01:15.000

Today we will be talking about some recent headlines that come out of the outdoor industry with a parting shot for Alex Honnold's big upcoming Netflix special. But fresh first. Our inbox is open, folks. We want to hear from you. Please send your emails to myrockfightmail.com that's where you can reach out.

And if you have a comment for the outdoor industry insider, Owen Comerford, you can email us@myrockfightmail.com or you can find the consigliere Owen Comerford on LinkedIn. Did you post anything last week, Owen?

Eoin Comerford

00:01:15.080 - 00:01:22.480

I did not. It's been busy. You know, people don't do anything for the last two weeks of the year and then they come back and they're just like, oh, yeah, right.

Colin True

00:01:22.480 - 00:01:26.520

They're like, hey, man, we took the last six weeks off, but now I need to talk to you immediately.

Eoin Comerford

00:01:26.520 - 00:01:35.170

Right? Everything is happening now, right? And it's like, shouldn't we have planned 2026 before 2026? But anyway, whatever it's up to, all.

Colin True

00:01:35.170 - 00:02:10.880

Those people can be blamed for lack of a LinkedIn post from Owen last week. How dare all of you do that. To deny us his wisdom. But normally you can find a couple of posts a week over on LinkedIn.

Reach out to Owen there if you want to get in touch with him. Also, don't miss the next episode of Gear Abbey, where Shante Salibair will answer all of your burning outdoor questions.

You can find Gear Abby on your favorite podcast app. However, starting today, we are going to check in on our latest survey.

This past week in Rock Fight's newsletter, news from the front, we sent out a new listener survey that was seeking some positivity along with some feedback from our listeners. We Asked you, the listeners, what outdoor brand?

Producer Dave

00:02:10.880 - 00:02:14.240

Why is that so? Why does that seem so out of place, Colin?

Colin True

00:02:14.240 - 00:02:19.240

Because the world is burning down around us. So, like, we just basic, what are you happy about?

Producer Dave

00:02:19.800 - 00:02:24.080

I thought that was, you know, is your hot take related to that? Is that the deal?

Colin True

00:02:24.080 - 00:02:28.900

Nope. Just was hoping we get some people who told us some cool things about this industry that we working.

Producer Dave

00:02:29.860 - 00:02:32.660

Hot takes, cool things. Next on the Rock.

Eoin Comerford

00:02:32.980 - 00:02:46.100

But this, this, if you're, if you remember back to last week, this was actually inspired by the fact that 100% of the people in, in the survey last week agreed that it was going to be a shitty year, basically. So we're like, yeah, please give us some good news.

Colin True

00:02:46.100 - 00:03:40.880

It's gonna be a down year. We, we agree. 100% of us agree. So, yeah. We asked, what outdoor brands are you excited about? What outdoor industry trends are you excited about?

And what is an. And who is an outdoor industry retailer that is doing it right in 2026? We got a ton of great responses.

So I think we're going to keep this train going. We're going to ask another question for next week's episode.

So if you want to get the survey, first, sign up for news from the front by heading to Rockfight Co, and then we'll post the survey link on LinkedIn a day or two after the survey comes out. But let's go through some of the responses we got. We got what outdoor, what outdoor industry brands are you excited about?

Number one came in Lem's supporter of the show. I'm a Lem's dealer and the brand brings people in. That's pretty good. We gotta vote for Patagonia.

Patagonia just, you know, continues to be a brand people are excited about and good on them for doing it. We're fans of Patagonia. Despite maybe some of the things you hear and some of the comments you might read on Apple podcasts.

We are supporters of Patagonia.

Eoin Comerford

00:03:40.880 - 00:03:42.360

Yeah, we are. Absolutely.

Colin True

00:03:43.640 - 00:03:46.840

Dave, take a victory lap. Wait, someone who just wrote in acg.

Producer Dave

00:03:47.880 - 00:03:49.240

Oh, there you go.

Colin True

00:03:49.400 - 00:03:53.000

This was a good one. Fjallraven, Nerona, anything Scandinavian.

Eoin Comerford

00:03:55.160 - 00:03:55.880

I'm all for that.

Colin True

00:03:56.920 - 00:04:24.680

They still truly understand what being outdoors should represent. A few votes for Mammut. Some of the new products they're bringing in. Also some people, this is obviously a buyer.

They say, I'm looking at steel and rab as replacements for some of my current gear. We had a vote for Kip Run, who we saw at the running event, and then Topo. I thought this one was Interesting.

Topo, one of the only shoe brands I hear people swear by and now it's number four and number five on the 25 PCT. The 2025 PCT gear survey.

Producer Dave

00:04:24.840 - 00:04:29.160

Are you sure they're not swearing at them? Just one of them?

Colin True

00:04:29.160 - 00:04:42.280

Apparently not. The next one for Topo was Topo footwear because they realized toe boxes should be roomy and not cramped. Montreal was great. At Montreal was great.

Before Columbia fucked them up like, okay, dude, that was.

Producer Dave

00:04:42.840 - 00:04:49.720

That's a long time ago. That's like complaining about the Egyptian kind of monarchy screwing each other over 2,000 years ago.

Colin True

00:04:49.800 - 00:04:50.920

No, it was a long time ago.

Producer Dave

00:04:51.690 - 00:04:52.490

Yeah, like really?

Eoin Comerford

00:04:52.730 - 00:04:53.530

That's a deep cut.

Colin True

00:04:54.570 - 00:04:56.730

Yeah. Statue of limitations has expired on that one.

Eoin Comerford

00:04:56.730 - 00:05:03.690

Yeah, they're still going on with their mantra. They've got some cloud veil that they're really looking to get going.

Colin True

00:05:05.610 - 00:05:06.330

To get some hate.

Eoin Comerford

00:05:06.330 - 00:05:07.690

Yeah, some Dana designs.

Producer Dave

00:05:08.010 - 00:05:08.770

Oh, come on.

Colin True

00:05:08.770 - 00:05:19.130

We had one vote for Astral and then one that was just Mount to Coast, Norda 7Mesh, Madison Normal and Garmin. So I don't know if that's just a rock fight super fan, but that was a good one.

Producer Dave

00:05:19.130 - 00:05:20.610

Sounds like a sales reps portfolio.

Chris DeMakes

00:05:20.610 - 00:05:20.930

That's right.

Colin True

00:05:20.930 - 00:05:21.930

All the brands that I represent.

Producer Dave

00:05:22.910 - 00:05:23.230

That's right.

Colin True

00:05:23.230 - 00:05:31.550

What outdoor industry trends are you excited about? Somebody said putting bikes back within the canon of outdoor. I opened a shop with the idea of that being a big part of it.

Producer Dave

00:05:32.430 - 00:05:32.910

Yes.

Colin True

00:05:33.070 - 00:05:40.190

They said I started off in the bike industry in 2000, but it's the outdoor industry that gives me hope. That's nice. Okay, so this one is a. Some things.

Producer Dave

00:05:40.590 - 00:05:41.550

We found the one.

Eoin Comerford

00:05:42.270 - 00:05:42.710

This is.

Colin True

00:05:42.710 - 00:05:48.990

The more things change, the more they stay the same. We had back to back answers of fast packing and then the next one was ultralight and sustainability.

Producer Dave

00:05:49.150 - 00:05:51.550

Did anybody mention the timing of trade shows?

Colin True

00:05:54.110 - 00:06:02.990

Yes, actually. This is a good way to move the last one. First of all, the second to last one was E Mountain bike. Gotta love those things.

I feel I'm being trolled with that comment 100%.

Producer Dave

00:06:03.230 - 00:06:03.710

Yes.

Colin True

00:06:04.110 - 00:06:20.760

The last comment here on this one that I wanted to read was in person. Events are back. Big events by big corporations trying to make big money will always be lame.

But small scale events by small brands or shops having a small impact on small communities are rad. Put that on a T shirt.

Producer Dave

00:06:21.560 - 00:06:24.560

Okay. Right. Size shaming.

Colin True

00:06:24.560 - 00:06:43.800

And then who is an outdoor industry retailer that is doing it right in 2026? We had a bunch of responses. We had a few for our pal Lloyd Vogel and Garage growing gear. It's the best place to Find gear that you really need.

It's not REI or Dick's, but then we had some people who wrote in rei. We had a bunch of REI respondents. Here we go. Not sure I live in Portland. Dave, did you write in.

Producer Dave

00:06:46.280 - 00:06:46.920

What are they saying?

Colin True

00:06:46.920 - 00:06:49.880

Independent specialty is lacking. I wish we had a shields.

Eoin Comerford

00:06:52.720 - 00:06:53.200

Okay.

Producer Dave

00:06:53.760 - 00:06:55.360

We don't even have an rei.

Colin True

00:06:56.000 - 00:07:11.240

Your local skate or snowboard shop and then the last one Winthrow in Seattle. They carry rad brands not found at REI backcountry. You can actually go in and discover a new product or brand. Plus they put on dope events.

Sounds like that's a rock fight endorsed retailer right there. They're doing all the things we say you should do.

Eoin Comerford

00:07:11.240 - 00:07:11.680

Yes.

Colin True

00:07:12.160 - 00:08:32.500

Oh, and then the other last one was in the uk. So our international listeners weighing in Treads, which is an online retailer, they do good discounts in posts. Brick and mortar also.

So there you go. Let's get into the headlines we want to talk about today. So this past week we saw comments made by a bunch of notable outdoor industry leaders.

Mary Beth Lawton of REI and Ed Stack from Dick's both spoke at the 2026 National Retail Federation.

MB spoke about REI's Peak 28 strategy and the role of AI and tech in outdoor retail, while Ed Stack reiterated his enthusiasm for Dick's acquisition of Footlocker.

Also presenting at NRF for the leaders of Timberland and the North Basin vans and speaking of those VF owned brands per SGB at the ICR conference, VF CEO Bracken Darrell, who still has the undisputed best name in the industry, focus his presentation on the future of vans in Timberland and the North Face. For Vans, that means a focus on product for tn. This is according to what Daryl's comments during his presentation.

For the North Face, Darrell sees untapped opportunities in the US Maybe surprisingly with us on this podcast here. And for Timberland, that means capitalizing on the classic yellow boots resurgence. So a lot of CEO talk in the news this past week.

Owen, what were your takeaways from the recap of Brack and Daryl's ICR presentation?

Eoin Comerford

00:08:33.140 - 00:08:46.320

I mean, my takeaway from all of these presentations is they've all been to the same media training, which basically is how do I talk for 15 to 30 minutes and not say a damn thing? I mean, let's say enough that we.

Colin True

00:08:46.320 - 00:08:48.240

Have a bunch of articles published about it, right?

Eoin Comerford

00:08:48.320 - 00:09:24.120

It was a whole bunch of brand gobbledygook in there, but I think there were some nuggets specifically from Brack and Daryl's presentation. I think if you read between the lines, what you have to do in these things. Vans is taking a little longer than they thought it would. Right.

Because I think Sonny Clow is the CEO they brought in there. Some of the product redo that she's undertaken is coming to the market.

It sounds like it has some traction, but as of the last quarter, they were still down. I think it was 9 or 10%.

Colin True

00:09:25.720 - 00:09:28.280

They lost Dave to ACG this past year, too.

Eoin Comerford

00:09:28.280 - 00:09:31.640

Okay. So I mean, that right there, I mean that's a major hit.

Producer Dave

00:09:32.200 - 00:09:34.600

It counts for at least 10 pairs.

Eoin Comerford

00:09:35.880 - 00:10:47.690

And they are talking about change to distribution and I think there's obviously still work to be done there, but they feel like the momentum is coming, but it hasn't shown in the numbers.

And then for North Face, the interesting thing there was, as you pointed out, the fact that they thought that they had opportunity in the U.S. that's where they thought they were under penetrated. And it's like, really, have you been to a soccer game in any Midwestern town? I mean, everyone's in North Face.

But I think the subtext there was the year round aspect. You know, I think what, let's face it, North Face, for all intents and purposes, is a lifestyle outerwear brand. Right?

That's just the major chunk of their business.

And so the code that they've got to crack is, okay, how do we get the people that wear our outerwear in the winter to wear our other stuff in the summer? And so that, that to me is kind of is where the penetration is.

And I'm sure, especially given the weather that we're seeing out west right now, I'm sure they would love to be less weather dependent in terms of their outerwear business.

Colin True

00:10:48.410 - 00:10:56.810

I want your inbox to brace for the incoming, the influx of emails from the outdoor fanboys who said, comerford, you said North Face isn't an outdoor brand anymore.

Eoin Comerford

00:10:57.130 - 00:10:59.210

I didn't say that exactly.

Colin True

00:10:59.290 - 00:11:00.570

That's how they're going to take it.

Producer Dave

00:11:01.370 - 00:11:05.770

Well, Owen, finish your thought about the streamlined focus.

Eoin Comerford

00:11:06.970 - 00:11:14.920

So one of the things that the CEO there, I think it's Caroline Brown, I want to say. Is that right?

Colin True

00:11:14.920 - 00:11:15.280

Yes.

Producer Dave

00:11:15.280 - 00:11:15.640

Yeah.

Eoin Comerford

00:11:15.960 - 00:12:05.640

So one of the things that the CEO there said, Caroline Brown in her piece was talking about this streamlined focus that they have around snow climb and trail and that those have become like the new touch points for everything that they do. Every product that they, that they build has to really address one of those three things, snow, climb or trail.

But I think the challenge with that is realistically, if they're going to appeal to that jacket buyer in the summer, it's going to be more of a lifestyle piece.

And maybe it's trail inspired or climb inspired, but, you know, that person buying, you know, the nipsey jacket and walking around Central park, they're not going to buy, you know, tights for the climbing gym or whatever. I mean, not necessarily. There's some overlap there, but it's not a lot.

Producer Dave

00:12:07.080 - 00:12:21.440

I think I've cracked the code now that you've point that out. Snow climb and trail, maybe that's just another way to say party career and commuting. And that could be their lifestyle focus. Right.

They told us where they're going.

Colin True

00:12:21.440 - 00:12:24.120

Yeah. Why can't a lifestyle have categories like that?

Producer Dave

00:12:25.000 - 00:12:36.220

Right. I mean, clearly, clearly. And I just wanted to say one thing about vans, because I have to weigh in.

I think they're facing an existential crisis that's way bigger than their product.

Eoin Comerford

00:12:36.220 - 00:12:36.780

Okay.

Producer Dave

00:12:36.780 - 00:13:42.170

I think they're reflexively going to say, he's being sincere. Oh, I'm being sincerely bitty. But no, they are no longer the symbol of alternative culture that they once were.

They've lost their edge about defining that side of subculture. And that's not coming back. And that's okay. It's just that they've grown way out of that.

And today I think they have more in common with the gap than they do with alternative subculture. And so the fixes that are gonna be required, while product is always a launchpad, you always need to keep bringing out the new.

But the idea that they're gonna land on a checkerboard, slip on or an old school that's gonna redefine the brand is very small. I think this is about branding. And really, once they've got to this level of polish, it's hard to be the icon of alternative.

And so how are they going to adjust that message going forward as a brand that is new and not what they were before and distribution's a part of that product mix, all of that, but it's. It is a new vans, and I don't know if they fully embrace that yet.

Colin True

00:13:43.770 - 00:14:11.540

Well, the trend parts of piece of it's interesting, right? I mean, I think kind of moving into the Timberland part of it. Right.

So Timberland, obviously we gave them a little grief a couple of weeks ago because of their terrible boot that they came out with. But aside from that, the. Apparently the yellow boot is seeing a comeback. Right. That's starting to trend more as a, as a, as a fashion item.

Do you see a footwear trend shift coming, Dave, because of, you know, because, because of what Vans is trying to do that more people are buying boots which you think we, the, the running thing wears out a little in the.

Producer Dave

00:14:11.540 - 00:15:06.970

Olden days that would be true. I'm not sure that that's the same that the hot boot style will be the harbinger of a trend shift.

I mean the certainly, the vans challenges certainly add to that in terms of silhouettes are going to be popular and even with the, the heat that they're getting, I'm not sure that the wheat boot has the pull that it wants that once did.

But yes, the idea that we can be shifting into preference to chunkier shoes, even the trail running thing is, is predicated a bit on that it's taking the sleek silhouettes of run or even the maximalism of kind of cushion and bringing in a new kind of chunk, if you will, even if it's just in tread size. So I think that's all part of it.

But I think it's definitely going to be a part of Timberland's kind of DNA mix as they try to what is expand from just kind of a boot offering.

Colin True

00:15:06.970 - 00:15:08.650

Yeah, I mean this is a little like oh, go ahead Owen.

Eoin Comerford

00:15:08.650 - 00:15:31.190

But like so from a, you know, alternative to the mainstream kind of approach which Van's was and you could say Tim's to a degree because it, cause it, you know, came out of urban culture, et cetera. The fact that the, that maximalist shoe is now the mainstream, I mean we saw it at theory, right? It was every effing shoe looked the same.

Colin True

00:15:31.270 - 00:15:34.350

We're going to talk about one coming up here which has a maximalist look to it.

Eoin Comerford

00:15:34.350 - 00:16:01.170

Right, right, exactly. And so now every asshole is wearing those shoes. Right. And so potentially this asshole included. So potentially.

Now if you are part of a counterculture, if you will, like a Vans wanted to be and once was then going back to a flat bottomed, low profile look or a BO is counterculture to the, to the core.

Producer Dave

00:16:02.450 - 00:16:45.960

Yeah, you're totally right. And again I say that without, I mean yes, Vans is still a marker of a counterculture. Converse is still going to be that way.

Dr. Martens is still going to be. They have resonance. They're not going away from it.

It's just that their brands have shifted in a big macro sense and like I said, they've gotten much more polished. And so it's like taking a. Now, now it's like taking a dress shoe and scuffing it and wearing it into situations. That you wouldn't normally.

I mean, it's just they now kind of cross both of those worlds. But yeah, I think young, young subversives will still continue to grow up wearing some of those footwear choices.

Colin True

00:16:45.960 - 00:17:33.909

Well, these are three really interesting brands for a conversation like this. Right? Because they, in their own way, have established movements in a lot of ways, like coming out of the 70s, 80s, 90s.

I mean, what does a trend even mean anymore? And when now we're in a world of niche, small audiences all the way from. Great point, right? Pop culture, sport, all these things.

Interests are now being served. There was a time where it's like, hey, boots are coming back. Put your Chucks away and your vans away because we're wearing boots now.

Now it's like, yeah, okay, there's some more interest maybe in this, in boots, but doesn't mean that you can't still wear sambas or Chucks or vans or whatever it is and still be considered cool, Right? Because now it's more about like, what's your personal brand and your personal look and your personal.

How are you dressing is more important than fitting into the broader monoculture, which doesn't really exist anymore.

Producer Dave

00:17:33.909 - 00:17:45.589

Right. Well, it's more like music. Yeah, right. You have your. You have so many styles, brands, choices, everything at your fingertips.

The exclusivity aspect is hard to replicate.

Colin True

00:17:46.389 - 00:18:11.090

So thinking about that, like this strategy, like, if they're really leaning back into the yellow boot, which probably makes sense, it's iconic, it's a. It's a boot that people know and everyone should have a pair in your closet, all that kind of thing, can that pay off?

I mean, if, you know, as dicks looks to figure out Foot Locker's future, Right. If you look at the retail, how you bring this a trend and your product back to a retailer, you know, how does this, how do you.

Does this strategy pay off to kind of focus in on the yellow boot?

Eoin Comerford

00:18:11.490 - 00:20:09.010

I think so. I don't think Tim's ever really stopped focusing on the yellow boot, if we're being honest.

I think that the challenge that Tim's has with the yellow boot or fans, maybe even with the old school, is when you get so identified with one style, style, you're just such a victim, if you will, to the ebbs and flows of whether that style is in or out. Same with the Chuck Taylor, right? It's like that is the style.

You can make a whole shit ton of other great stuff and great styles, but if 80% of your business is in this one style, it becomes challenging, right? You're not as resilient to the market.

And I think there was an interesting comment from Bracken during his presentation that the top seller of the, of the 6 inch boot back in the day was a single foot action store out of New Jersey, right. And foot actually used to be owned by Foot Locker.

So it does kind of get you thinking like okay, well is like, is that the entree to you know, footlocker being more on trend? And you know, I must admit I haven't been into a physical footlocker in a decade. So it's been a, it's been, been a hot minute.

But I was online on there and they have 12 different styles of the Tim boot today. The six inch and four of those are exclusives like, like a, like a, like a blue suede type of one.

There's like some color, some, some with like patent leather for, for, for the lower part of the upper. I mean just interesting stuff. So I could see a world in which as, as they take their merchandising to the next level.

A much more curated approach which Ed Stack is talking about to where you could have a more of a capsule collection for Tim's in a, in a, in a footlocker store where it's a, it's a whole thing versus just one more pair of boots on the wall.

Colin True

00:20:09.010 - 00:20:33.550

Dave, does that something we talk about on the show a bunch and you and I have talked about offline is the, a lot of, a lot of outdoor industry brands insisting on product marketing over brand marketing, right? And so to that to Owen's point, like, you know, now you have the 6 inch boot is everywhere. You can find multiple versions of it on here.

And like, so if it differentiates is the Strat strategy to then elevate the brand as opposed to focusing in on a single product.

Producer Dave

00:20:34.270 - 00:22:05.060

I think what, what you're kind of even pointing at is that the customer traditionally in an athletics or lifestyle space like a footlocker or foot action, isn't there necessarily buying on feature, right?

So even though they're looking for an outdoor capable product like a boot or an outdoor type boot, that's not the appeal to it, it's the, it's the fashionability, it's the style.

And so therefore making sure your brands stay up in that kind of style desire place within the feature benefits being more of a rationalization to that emotional kind of want that's primary in that distribution. So if you're going to distribute there, you need to play in that and recognize that's where that customer's at.

And then of course, the specialty equation might be different. Right. In terms of where you're leaning into and what kind of the customer is looking for. So I think it has to, to do with, with that kind of play.

I mean, foot action was always interesting because they were always a more of a streetwear seasonal trend, like life tile silhouette kind of thing with athletic tinge to it, made them distinct from Foot Locker. And really what you've seen since they acquired and, you know, re gestated and spit up foot action, it's. They've kind of adopted some of that.

So I think Foot Locker can create the, like you said, curated spaces or just the distribution or the, I should say, the product mix that will allow them to go from core functional athletic product all the way into style trend outdoor product. Right, yeah.

Eoin Comerford

00:22:05.060 - 00:22:12.260

Because I think a lot of what good merchandising about is actually having a point of view. Right. And I think.

Producer Dave

00:22:12.260 - 00:22:13.100

Right, exactly.

Eoin Comerford

00:22:13.260 - 00:22:39.320

You know, what Ed Sack was talking about in the latest call was that it was just a sea of like, just a string of shoes, one, one after the other, not differentiated in any way, versus basically taking a point of view and saying, no, no, no, we're not going to show you whatever, 50 basketball shoes. We're going to show you 15 basketball shoes. But we're going to romance the hell out of those shoes.

And we're telling you that these are the shoes you want because these are the coolest shoes.

Producer Dave

00:22:39.480 - 00:22:45.480

Right, I agree. I'd like to see what, what Dick Locker is going to do with their, you know, distinction for sure.

Colin True

00:22:46.680 - 00:22:50.720

All right, guys, well, I think it's time for the lightning round. Are we ready?

Eoin Comerford

00:22:50.720 - 00:22:51.800

Oh, so ready.

Producer Dave

00:22:51.800 - 00:22:52.360

Okay.

Colin True

00:22:58.900 - 00:23:19.780

All right, first up in the lightning round, per retail boss J. Crew has launched a new collection of lifestyle apparel.

As a partner of the US Ski and Snowboard Team, the 26 piece capsule collection is hitting at the perfect time just ahead of the upcoming Winter Olympics. Dave, reading this made me think one thing and one thing only J. Crew still exists. How did I miss that?

Eoin Comerford

00:23:20.180 - 00:23:26.790

Well, you're, you're not a, you're not a 50 something woman, Colin. So that's as far as we know.

Colin True

00:23:27.510 - 00:23:27.910

What?

Producer Dave

00:23:28.230 - 00:23:36.070

As far as we know? Right. Oh, Colin, I, I. Look, I know I have a soft spot for Jake. I do too.

Eoin Comerford

00:23:36.070 - 00:23:38.230

By the way, growing up in the.

Producer Dave

00:23:38.709 - 00:24:36.530

80S and 90s there. Look, the last 15 years has been nothing but a slow slide into downward pricing and blending in.

I mean, that's, that is, there's just no way around that. And look, all these retailers have come in and taken their place. I mean, that's just.

They took what they kind of pioneered and turned it into kind of now this kind of base segment, if you will. That said, I love this collection. I think it is. Looks great. It completely captures, to me, the brand represents this kind of Americana.

Timely, timeless, a little bit of preppy with a nostalgic kind of edge, but it's modern.

Honestly, I think sports teams could learn from this collection, frankly, and how to take your brand a simple slogan or an icon, like what they're doing with the team and the flag and turning it into really interesting wearable concepts and silhouettes. I think they're gonna make. I think they're gonna sell a lot of these pieces. They're just wearable.

Chris DeMakes

00:24:36.530 - 00:24:37.010

Yeah.

Producer Dave

00:24:37.250 - 00:24:49.790

Beyond being kind of winter Olympic and American flag kind of focused, I think they do. I think it's a great job. I was surprised, I thought how well it came together. It was very accessible and very clean.

Eoin Comerford

00:24:49.790 - 00:24:56.750

It feels like though it could have. These things could have come from the 80s, you know, in terms of, like the photography and the overall feel.

Producer Dave

00:24:57.550 - 00:25:00.910

The 80s doing the 50s, right.

Colin True

00:25:01.310 - 00:25:17.840

All right, next up. According to Footwear News, British retailer JD Sports is launching a new way of shopping through AI platforms.

Customers will now be able to purchase directly through AI platforms like Google, Gemini and ChatGPT. Owen, are you excited to claim an early victory for one of your 2026 predictions?

Eoin Comerford

00:25:17.840 - 00:25:24.160

I am always excited to claim a victory, Colin, although I don't think I can totally claim it here because this will.

Colin True

00:25:24.160 - 00:25:24.640

I will give it to you.

Eoin Comerford

00:25:24.640 - 00:25:40.090

Oh, thank you. I appreciate that. You're an easy scorer.

I would only give myself maybe even partial credit on this one just because I was thinking more in terms of on site custom LLMs for the. For a brand. This is.

Colin True

00:25:40.250 - 00:25:40.650

Right.

Eoin Comerford

00:25:40.650 - 00:26:33.080

This is on the broader, you know, LLM itself. And really it's more of a kind of an, like an IT payments integration story because you can get on there. You can ask, you know, what your.

What your what sort of footwear. I mean, JD is owner of a finish line and, you know, one of the bigger players in England or in the uk.

But you can ask about what kind of athletic footwear it'll help you. ChatGPT will. And then you can just click on a link and buy it directly. Now it requires you to set up payments.

And then I think the interesting question here is how quickly will people trust giving an AI their credit card? Right. And I know I probably sound like, you know, the young people, like oh, sure, what the hell.

Colin True

00:26:33.080 - 00:26:34.840

But like Grandpa 1996.

Eoin Comerford

00:26:34.840 - 00:26:35.640

Well, exactly, right?

Colin True

00:26:35.640 - 00:26:37.060

I mean, mail my check in.

Producer Dave

00:26:37.060 - 00:26:41.660

Well, my day, we had to enter it in each field, but.

Eoin Comerford

00:26:41.900 - 00:26:51.220

But, well, right. A quarter century ago people were saying that about E commerce. Like I'm never going to put my, put my credit card into a website. Are you crazy? So I.

Colin True

00:26:51.220 - 00:26:52.420

How convenient, right?

Eoin Comerford

00:26:52.420 - 00:27:08.550

I think it'll happen, but I don't know. There's also a lot of, you know, kind of AI run run rampant fears here, you know.

And, and is the AI going to go off and you know, buy a bunch of uranium on the black market with your credit card?

Producer Dave

00:27:08.550 - 00:27:22.950

I don't know. The answer is yes. And the answer is also, AI is not dumb.

They're going to take those fears and turn it into an old school order form and you're going to put your credit card in just like you're doing now. And you'll never be the wiser until.

Colin True

00:27:22.950 - 00:27:24.350

The uranium shows up at your door.

Producer Dave

00:27:24.350 - 00:27:28.550

Until the uranium shows up. Or at least the government agency investigating the purchase.

Colin True

00:27:29.600 - 00:27:34.320

If you get some uranium and you have a flux capacitor. Oh, that was plutonium. I don't know what the difference is.

Producer Dave

00:27:34.800 - 00:27:35.520

Processing.

Colin True

00:27:35.680 - 00:27:58.120

Okay. All right, last one. According to a press release, Outdoor Research has announced its newest team of athletes.

This group will be composed of elite skiers and snowboarders and they will make up the OR Athlete Glove Team. That's right. It's a big win for the accessories category as OR has a glove specific team. Dave, thoughts on a category specific athlete team?

Is this long overdue? Too specific? What do you think?

Eoin Comerford

00:27:58.120 - 00:28:06.890

Exactly where is the Gator Team? That's what I want. Yeah, forget about the glove team. I want the OR Gator Team. That's the team.

Colin True

00:28:07.050 - 00:28:10.770

That's right. We've all been waiting years for the Gator Team.

Producer Dave

00:28:10.770 - 00:28:56.290

Oh, Owen, I have to agree. The Gator Team is a must. That is what I am here for. Well, I love this. I love the fact that they're making a big deal of it.

I mean, it's like not even new. I mean, Skeeta's got a whole business built on athletes wearing accessories, right?

So it's not like it's a crazy idea, but it does kind of lead you down the path. Like, why not a Gator team? Why not a headlamp team? Just, you know, I want to see that just for the, the team photo grid.

It's all just people with their light flashing right in front of your face. Like you can't see their face. No, that'd Be awesome. That'd just be such a great. The new headlamp team.

And so I think we should ask what else would make a great accessory team? That's my question. Question to everybody. What would you build an athlete team around? What? Ath. What?

Eoin Comerford

00:28:56.290 - 00:29:09.570

Sticking with. Sticking with. Or I would go the sun hat, right? I mean a good sun hat team. Lots of sun hats.

You know, dorky looking dads out there in their or sun hats. That would be amazing.

Producer Dave

00:29:10.290 - 00:29:16.930

See Sunday afternoon sharpens their elbows and says no, no, I'm coming into this. This would be great. Love it.

Colin True

00:29:17.090 - 00:29:21.650

I'm writing this down for next week's survey. What would make for a good product focused athlete team.

Chris DeMakes

00:29:22.050 - 00:29:22.690

That's right.

Producer Dave

00:29:22.770 - 00:29:29.430

Oh dude, the sun. That's amazing. That that's actually could be a competitive category. Immediately you take. Yeah, I like that.

Colin True

00:29:29.430 - 00:29:57.680

I think it's kind of a funny thing that you can make fun of it for sure. Because it's funny. Hey, we have a glove team.

But also like it kind of seems overdue because I'm sure like or has lost out to athletes to bigger more well established or well funded anyway apparel brands, right? Like this skier went here. It's like hey, you know what we're really good at? We're really known for our accessories and our gloves. Fuck it.

We're going to be like we're going to become that. And I think that was really smart. So now, hey, you want to go be a North Face athlete? Great.

But I'm not wearing your gloves because I'm an or glove skier.

Producer Dave

00:29:57.760 - 00:30:22.890

You know, this is and it's a little little tangential, but this was kind of Wilson's issue for a long time that they lost out to all the athletes wearing Adidas or Nike or you know, Reebok and things like that. Couldn't pay. But they had the equipment, they had the racket or they had the ball, the basketball or the football.

And so it's a way to get into the athlete endorsement game but not. Not playing in that much bigger, more costly stage that might be the. In the entire body.

Eoin Comerford

00:30:23.370 - 00:30:40.890

So.

But I think the interesting thing here is actually this isn't entirely new because you know, because you've got glove specific brands that have athlete teams like Hestra. If you go to their site they have an our athletes page which is a bunch of people that wear has to gloves. So.

Producer Dave

00:30:41.050 - 00:30:41.410

Sure.

Eoin Comerford

00:30:41.410 - 00:30:49.720

Is it news? It's just the fact though that or which has a much wider product product line saying no no, no, we just have a set of glove people.

Producer Dave

00:30:50.600 - 00:30:51.320

Great point.

Colin True

00:30:52.440 - 00:32:09.440

All right, main story today. So per sgb, last week a new footwear brand is on the scene.

Stoke footwear launched on January 5th and according to its website, it is a shoe brand for, quote, real American men. Men who don't run marathons or walk catwalks. According to Stoke, they deliver fit, comfort and power.

The product itself is running inspired in its look. The silhouettes look like running shoes. If you haven't seen it, definitely check it out.

We'll link it in the show notes the midsoles have kind of alluded to it earlier as during another topic. They have a bit of a modern running shoe stack height look to them.

But the brand says they are not making running shoes, but instead making shoes for big American men with wide and thick feet.

Now, listeners may be asking why we're covering a casual shoe made for people who likely don't do or even understand the activities we do in the outdoor industry.

Well, it's because that in addition to being able to buy Stoke Footwear direct on their website, last week the brand announced they'll be launching in 450 retail doors across the U.S. those retailers include Rack Room, Shoe Department Shoe and Shoe Sensation, as well as Academy and wait for it, Shields. So guys, this brand is probably making the core outdoor folks lose their mind right now. Oh, and let's start with you impressions of Stoke Footwear.

Eoin Comerford

00:32:10.240 - 00:33:35.160

Well, first of all, clearly this thing has some major backing, right? You don't launch with that sort of retailer group without some serious dollars behind you. And also its founder, Rick Blackshaw knows shoes.

I mean this guy was previously the leader of hey dude. Which he built into almost a billion dollar brand. CCM Hockey, Sperry Keds. So he's been around the block.

So I wouldn't think of second guessing the strategy of somebody like that. But that said, I don't know, my problem is whatever.

But you can talk about the sort of the Bubba Manosphere brand positioning and I'm sure Dave will get into that. But to me it's the product. If you just took this shoe and I encourage people to go on to stokeshoes.com and just look at the shoe by its.

And if you took that by itself and said what is this shoe? I think 90% of people say, oh, it's a shoe for a 10 year old boy that's into Buzz Lightyear. I mean it's stubby so it looks like a child's shoe.

It's got a lightning bolt on the side. I'm not kidding. It has a lightning bolt on the Side, it looks like a kid's shoe. And so that, to me, I think, is where it's just.

I don't know, it's odd.

Colin True

00:33:36.440 - 00:34:05.120

85 bucks price point. So it's very affordable. By the way. You're not being insulting objectively. It looks like a children's shoe. And all the little features.

It has the, hey, you don't need to bend over to put your shoes on. Big vamp in the back. I mean, all the sort of sketchers. Hey, dudes. Sort of little features and benefits for the everyday American.

Before we get into sort of the industry piece of it all. Dave, what are your thoughts on Stoke footwear?

Producer Dave

00:34:07.490 - 00:34:16.050

Well, until you put this in front of me, I was blissfully unaware of this brand, and now I am not. And now I cannot unsee it.

Colin True

00:34:17.970 - 00:34:20.850

But it gave you the opportunity to make more opinions, which is your favorite?

Producer Dave

00:34:20.930 - 00:34:56.089

It did, it did.

And look, I hate this in the sense that I am all for brands and products that speak to specific people, that if there is a niche for this, then more power to you. But everything Owen said is right. I mean, stubby is the way you describe this. There's no other word really to describe it. It is a lightning bolt.

It does have a superhero kids concept. I kind of likened this. If Gimli, son of Gloin, had a trainer or a signature trainer, this might be his.

Colin True

00:34:56.729 - 00:34:59.609

Or is this the Roy Hobbs signature wonder boy?

Producer Dave

00:34:59.609 - 00:35:25.960

Well, it's definitely wonder shoe, no doubt about it. But. But I guess for me, it feels, and this may go into the kind of the kids estimate, it feels like it's just trying too hard. Right.

And so you're good. All these things, even the name slip tagline slip on Stoke out, which feels a little bit too close to stroke out.

And that might be too on the money for the marketplace.

Eoin Comerford

00:35:26.280 - 00:35:31.830

Actually, they do come talk about. One of their key features, Dave, is big box, big ball girth.

Producer Dave

00:35:31.990 - 00:35:32.990

Big ball girth.

Colin True

00:35:32.990 - 00:35:35.630

What are they watching? Their only fans channel. Yeah, that's what we need to know.

Producer Dave

00:35:35.630 - 00:35:58.530

Maybe. Maybe that's where it came from. But I think that leads into the juvenile feel of this. This kind of man childy superhero thing. And.

But, you know, at the same time, if you'd asked me what I thought about, hey, dude when they were launching that I would say there's no way in hell that'll go anywhere. That's also juvenile and kind of silly. And, you know, look what they did. So, yeah, one of my.

Eoin Comerford

00:35:58.530 - 00:36:04.970

The other features are the mansplay midsole. So basically it's, you know, Wider toe box.

Producer Dave

00:36:06.810 - 00:36:08.410

It tells your toes how to be.

Eoin Comerford

00:36:09.210 - 00:36:24.980

Not mansplain, mansplay. And then there's the power stack. The most underfoot cushioning. I mean this thing is like, has got like 40 plus millimeters of stack height.

It is, it is basically a platform soul of a kind.

Producer Dave

00:36:24.980 - 00:36:28.420

Well, Ankle Breaker was already taken I guess as a, as a name.

Colin True

00:36:29.060 - 00:37:37.900

So we, look, we are not the customers for this. Like, you know, so we, we were. No matter what their distribution of this was going to be, we would be probably like not for us. Right.

But let's talk for a minute about this, right, because you mentioned, hey dude, that's the brand I thought of the most when I saw it. It reminds me of like a sneaker version of hey dude in that audience.

I think what Rick, Rick Blackshaw, you mentioned, the founder, he, what he started here is a little bit of a blow to those kind of core outdoor purists, right? Because they, they see this brand as the definition of using active heritage to build a brand and product for the non active consumer.

And the strategy is basically being validated out of the gate with Shiels. That's the real reason we wanted to bring it up on the pod. You know, it's one of the more respected larger retailers in the outdoor space.

The survey we talked about earlier, somebody saying, I wish we had a Scheels in our town in Portland. So that's one of their launch partners. So Owen, just for a second, you put on your retailer hat, try to take your bias out of it.

Obviously, you know, I would never expect to see you rocking a pair of wonder boy Stoke footwear, silk shoes at a trade show or anything.

But if you were at Moose Jaw or another, you know, which was another respected Midwest retail chain, would you have considered being a launch partner for a brand like Stoke?

Eoin Comerford

00:37:37.900 - 00:37:56.160

No. Yeah. No. So, so deflate. No. Well, a couple of reasons. One is one of the core values of Mistra was only do what's cool.

And really the subtext of that was we only really sell stuff that we ourselves would buy and wear or use.

Producer Dave

00:37:56.400 - 00:37:56.800

Right.

Eoin Comerford

00:37:57.760 - 00:38:26.390

Which is not the case here or I think for certainly not the case for the core buyers within Moosera. This would not have been what they wanted to do.

Plus the price point really was, is a little bit sub premium in the current world where the average shoe price, unfortunately or fortunately, whichever side of the coin you're on is north of $125 to bring in. You know, a shoe at this price point wouldn't, wouldn't have really made a Ton of sense for us.

Colin True

00:38:26.390 - 00:39:05.070

But this isn't a, sort of a good example that this is where the industry's going in a lot of ways. I mean the sea of sameness stuff is real.

There's a lot of stuff out there and a lot of folks who maybe would be a stoke customer are going to a store like a Shields or potentially other outdoor retailers and what they're seeing on the wall, I mean we've talked about this pod a ton that running shoes used to be the kind of every person shoe that people and still is to a certain degree. But you know, $120 used to be an expensive pair of running shoes. Now you see that, you're like, oh, that's great. And that price keeps going up.

So to have a sort of running inspired everyday shoe for 85 bucks, I think you can make the case that that's probably an underserved market. Underserved consumer.

Eoin Comerford

00:39:05.070 - 00:39:29.140

Yeah, I mean it's like it is kind of hey dude meets sketchers, right? I mean that's basically, you know, that's what this thing is.

And I just wonder from a brand perspective, Will, even if it's a great shoe, super comfortable.

You know, they talk a lot in their, in their PR about the fact that basically Americans are all overweight and have big fat wide feet is basically what they say.

Colin True

00:39:29.780 - 00:39:31.220

That's their position for sure.

Eoin Comerford

00:39:31.300 - 00:40:14.510

And so that is they're basically tapping this, addressing this underserved market. And I think probably all of that is true from a marketing perspective.

I just wonder if that customer is going to want to be associated at a pure brand level with a brand that basically says we're for fat guys. Right. As opposed to because it's kind of the anti athletic brand to a degree.

So it's like, well, do I want to be associated with a brand that is sort of anti athletic or do I still want to pretend as if I made take off on a trail run on my break, lunch break because I'm wearing a pair of hokas to work?

Producer Dave

00:40:14.510 - 00:41:27.100

I think the positioning is the most interesting about it. I mean I, I buy into that whole like carving a distinction amongst the other runners, the actual market need.

I think the price play is also all of that to me is spot on. For me it's just more about the, the nuance, the subtlety of the branding to create something that is a little more neutral to that point.

It doesn't need to be over athleticized and performance. This just feels a little bit too juvenile. And if you were able to merge that I think you'd have a really strong play.

And I, I don't think you have to. I mean, they're talking to the trade audience right now about, you know, not being athletic.

If you go to their site, they're speaking in terms of activity and you know, wearing this. So I don't, I don't think that they're going to fall into the idea that people are identifying with I'm inactive and overweight. That's not the play.

It's just the reality of this is your body. And do these guys really give a crap?

I'm not sure they actually do, but I do think they value strength and modernity in that way and I think that would certainly help it. But no, I'm certainly fascinated to see where this thing goes.

Eoin Comerford

00:41:28.140 - 00:41:46.670

It does speak to the manosphere to me in the branding, in all of the terminology. There's kind of an America first aspect to this. Right. Which, you know, I think it actually says proudly American. Yeah.

Designed in the US designed in the usa. Made for the men who built it.

Colin True

00:41:46.670 - 00:41:53.629

Oh, they have the well known. The founding fathers all wore Stoke footwear. That's a common everyone. I learned that in school.

Eoin Comerford

00:41:53.629 - 00:41:54.390

Okay. Yes.

Colin True

00:41:54.630 - 00:42:02.070

Guys, what do you think the next the athlete team is going to be for Stoke footwear? You know, are we going to pair up with outdoor research and their glove team or.

Producer Dave

00:42:03.190 - 00:42:04.790

I so want to see that.

Colin True

00:42:06.240 - 00:42:23.760

I do think product wise they do need to. The stubby thing, the little kid looking shoe is like, it's not a good look. So if I'm going to be.

That's just me objectively looking at like it looks like you're wearing little kid shoes. So I don't know if that's going to play over well to dudes with big feet. They're going to be like, I don't know about that.

So if you get well, see, I.

Producer Dave

00:42:23.760 - 00:42:38.350

Think that's where it could be minimizing. I think that that could actually work. And you know, like we said, the athlete team, it's like Thorne's company in the Hobbit, right?

I mean it's just, just going to be a bunch of stout, strong dudes wearing Buzz Lightyear shoes.

Colin True

00:42:39.790 - 00:42:53.750

Now we're combining franchises. I won't stand for that. I mean it is, I think it's a. Who knows if this works or not, but somebody recognizing the larger stuff that we talk about.

Producer Dave

00:42:53.750 - 00:43:49.000

The poker will be a billion dollar look, you know, it's really what it is. And I just now thought of it. It's almost in a sense of of premium Walmart positioning.

You know, for so long, like with Walmart with their shoes, you couldn't pass like the 15 barrier. Right.

I mean it was just when we went, when I was part of the downing of and one when they were being sold and sold into Walmart and bringing them up to 2520 was a huge deal. It was the first shoe to break that price barrier.

And now they've kind of have all moved a little bit in some of their, their, their kind of like a vias in there, some of their other products. So this in a sense kind of feels like we're going at that customer with a product. But 80 buck now is just kind of, that still, still feels valuable.

Like I'm paying, I'm paying some dollars. But like we say, it's in no way relatable to the actual running shoe prices.

Colin True

00:43:49.000 - 00:44:17.300

That's, that's interesting. That's kind of summarizes the shift here. Right?

Because if we had seen this, if we had any of us been walking at Costco or Walmart and saw the shoe, we'd be like, we wouldn't have batted an eye and would on by. Right. Even at 80 bucks probably be like, okay, yeah, right.

But if you were shopping in a Shields and you're passing a lot of the brands that we talk about in this podcast and then boom, there's the wonder boy lightning bolt, you know, Stoke footwear shoe for 80 bucks. There's a little WTF that kind of crawls into your head, you know. So it's interesting that there that Shields is on board with it.

Producer Dave

00:44:17.460 - 00:44:20.340

So do you remember the retailer mvp?

Colin True

00:44:20.660 - 00:44:21.620

Of course. Yeah.

Producer Dave

00:44:21.700 - 00:44:50.330

Yeah, right. They had all of that.

And so I'm going to go back to the same time and this was the time of Kobe and Kobe's initial shoes and I forgot what number it was. But the Kobe Adidas shoe that was square and looked like a toaster, like it was just a squared off shoe.

Walked into one of those MVP which is already kind of just like, you know, free for all kind of anything. There were bins filled with that damn shoe without boxes. Just shoes of them full like 8 to 10.

Colin True

00:44:50.470 - 00:44:51.100

$49.99.

Producer Dave

00:44:51.260 - 00:45:02.020

That's right. And it was just all these square shoes. And that for me has for been forever connected to MVP and just massive silos of unsold square shoes.

Colin True

00:45:02.020 - 00:45:07.820

And that might be the what, what happens here. But I think, you know, I think it's telling. Shield's taking a shot at this. So.

Producer Dave

00:45:08.540 - 00:45:10.620

Yeah, it is. No, no doubt about it.

Colin True

00:45:11.180 - 00:45:11.740

All Right.

Eoin Comerford

00:45:11.740 - 00:45:24.910

I think it's interesting the reviews that they feature on their homepage. So these are handpicked. I'm a bigger guy. It's about time a shoe company focuses on people who aren't ultra athletic. I'm built like a brick. Shit.

Producer Dave

00:45:24.910 - 00:45:25.670

Handpicked.

Colin True

00:45:25.670 - 00:45:26.150

Do you.

Producer Dave

00:45:26.470 - 00:45:29.910

Do you mean. Do you mean pre written? Is that what you mean by hand?

Colin True

00:45:29.990 - 00:45:31.030

The CEO, Right?

Producer Dave

00:45:31.590 - 00:45:32.230

I don't know.

Eoin Comerford

00:45:34.550 - 00:45:39.110

I am built like a brick shithouse. Stoke is literally made for men like me.

Colin True

00:45:40.630 - 00:45:49.430

This is like one of us, like, you know, me writing in a review of the Rock Fight. Like, boy, the Rock Fight is a really great podcast. Really well produced and written and hosted.

Producer Dave

00:45:49.830 - 00:45:52.950

That's right. That Colin has great enunciation.

Eoin Comerford

00:45:53.110 - 00:46:02.480

So great. Like, yes, I am an average guy that needs a great shoe at a decent price. Said nobody ever. Yeah.

Colin True

00:46:02.480 - 00:46:03.520

Said chat GPT.

Producer Dave

00:46:05.600 - 00:46:07.920

Yes. Oh, my gosh.

Colin True

00:46:08.240 - 00:46:16.320

Oh, boy. All right, well, good luck to you, Stoke Footwear.

We'll see how this plays out 100% when we're all begging you for ad dollars in 12 months, we'll apologize.

Producer Dave

00:46:16.320 - 00:46:17.760

That's right. That's right.

Eoin Comerford

00:46:17.840 - 00:46:18.400

Yep.

Colin True

00:46:24.410 - 00:48:37.290

All right, time for the parting shot.

And this episode is out on Monday, January 19, and this Friday, January 23, acclaimed rock climber Alex Honnold will be free soloing a skyscraper live on Netflix in an event called Skyscraper Live. Really workshop that title. Good job, guys. I don't know about you guys.

I'm definitely going to be watching this, I think, and I'm sure that there's a really strong chance that Alex will be fine.

And all of next week will be filled with press releases and substack posts and stories on Gear Junkie and outside about the spectacle of the event and how inspiring it was and blah, blah, blah. And my parting shot isn't for the feat itself, but in the way it's being promoted, which I think is being is done in pretty poor taste.

So the magic of Free Solo, right, the film, the Oscar winning film that Alex was in was that it was produced as a film and uniquely outdoor.

And despite the fact that we knew Alex didn't die while free soloing El Cap because he was out doing press for the film, it was impossible not to be sucked in by the stakes of his climb and believe that perhaps the outcome wasn't already determined, that's kind of how he felt when you're watching the movie. Now this one's happening live, so if shit goes sideways, we'll get to join the Bud Dwyer all stars of watching someone die live on television.

Only in this Case we'll have chosen to watch it happen. And that possibility is basically how this thing is being marketed.

In the trailer, we hear Alex talk about the inherent risk of in free soloing, that he can't plan everything and that if something bad happens, he's going to die. That's what his he says in the trailer. And that's after we see footage of his little kid running around in interviews with his wife.

And I know that's all being done to promote the special. And it's working just like Frank. Frank Cross's violin promo for Scrooge work.

Because I'll be one of the millions who'll be sitting on their couch watching this unfold. And do I have a problem with Alex free soloing a building? Not at all.

If he truly has had a lifelong dream of climbing a building building like he says in the trailer, then have at it. But using the very real possibility of his demise to market the live broadcast of his climb.

After pulling my parenting and family heartstrings, it doesn't feel very good. So best of luck. Alex Honnold.

Like I said, I'm sure you're confident in the probability of your success is high, but the trailer for the special just made me feel gross. And that's my parting shot.

Eoin Comerford

00:48:37.450 - 00:48:55.430

Okay. I agree. It's right. Because that's what they're.

They're selling that, that Looky Lou, you know, sort of hard in your throat type of piece because it's live and you don't know what's going to happen. You don't know that he's going to make it up this, this sky if.

Colin True

00:48:55.430 - 00:49:01.910

He'S done it already and we knew he was alive, I'm on board with that. Right. Like, oh, see what happened? But it's like.

Producer Dave

00:49:04.630 - 00:49:23.630

To your point, it's all Looky Lou. I mean, free solo. You had Jimmy Chin, you had Elizabeth. What was it? Shaivar Dashiell. Like, it's an Oscar winning documentary.

It was a gorgeously made story. Again, even if you didn't know, I mean, there are a lot of people that probably watched it and didn't know for sure.

Colin True

00:49:23.630 - 00:49:24.110

You're right.

Producer Dave

00:49:24.270 - 00:49:33.550

Right. And it's just, it's a compelling. This feels like, it feels like Fox. Like, you know what I mean? It just, it feels like Fox.

It feels like the 90s kind of thing.

Eoin Comerford

00:49:34.270 - 00:49:47.590

This is gonna date myself dramatically here, but it feels like Evel Knievel going to jump the Grand Canyon kind of stuff. Right, Right. It's just tune in because you might see someone might see Someone die. Exactly. That, that's, that's the feeling that you get here.

Colin True

00:49:47.590 - 00:50:09.840

I, I, I don't know how you market this. I, you know, in a less gross way. I really don't like that.

You see again, the, the shot of the kid running around and then there's, you know, his wife talking to the camera. And if you've seen Free Solo, like, you recognize all of it.

I, it's just doesn't feel good and like, and I, and I wonder, you know, I'm not even going to speculate if the bad thing happens, but it's just like, it just doesn't feel good. So.

Producer Dave

00:50:09.920 - 00:50:20.440

Okay, so what's the over under on the insurance policy? Because Netflix, is this a Lloyd's of London type thing? Like, you know, there's some dabble in insurance?

Colin True

00:50:20.440 - 00:50:21.040

I don't think.

Producer Dave

00:50:21.200 - 00:50:26.480

Are you sure, Are you sure he's covered? Caitlin Clark. Right? No doubt.

Colin True

00:50:26.720 - 00:50:34.540

It's a good question. I mean, they have Netflix money, you know, and they're trying to buy Warner Brothers right now.

So they've got, I'm sure they, they could probably pull, if anybody could pull it off, they could, could. But.

Producer Dave

00:50:35.500 - 00:50:37.260

Yeah, I'm with you, Colin. I agree.

Colin True

00:50:37.340 - 00:50:38.260

Yeah. Thanks, guys.

Eoin Comerford

00:50:38.260 - 00:50:42.020

Fingers crossed. Fingers crossed for, I mean, are you.

Colin True

00:50:42.020 - 00:50:44.860

Well, actually, are you guys going to watch? Because I'm definitely going to watch.

Eoin Comerford

00:50:44.860 - 00:50:45.820

I don't think so.

Producer Dave

00:50:45.820 - 00:50:46.700

No, I will not.

Colin True

00:50:46.700 - 00:50:47.380

You don't think so?

Producer Dave

00:50:47.380 - 00:50:58.860

No, no, I actually now I'm going to be scouting for stoked shoes in terms of re watching the entire Lord of the Rings franchise, looking for characters that could fit.

Colin True

00:50:59.510 - 00:51:05.910

Maybe that's the sponsor that Hondl needs for this adventure is stoked footwear. You know, that's easy on and off.

Eoin Comerford

00:51:07.990 - 00:51:10.310

Stoke. Not stoked, by the way, just to be clear.

Colin True

00:51:10.310 - 00:51:11.270

Excuse me. Sorry.

Eoin Comerford

00:51:11.270 - 00:51:11.910

I'll dare.

Chris DeMakes

00:51:11.910 - 00:51:12.230

I.

Producer Dave

00:51:13.750 - 00:51:14.390

Good point.

Colin True

00:51:14.470 - 00:51:34.310

All right, that's the show. Send your emails in myrockfightmail.com TheRockFight's a production of Rock Fight LLC.

Today's episode produced by producer Dave, with art direction provided by Sarah Gensler. Concert 400 and Comerford. I'm Colin True. Thank you for listening. And here to take us out is Chris d' Meigs with the Rock Fight Fight song.

See you next time, Rock Fighters.

Chris DeMakes

00:51:34.310 - 00:52:35.370

Boom. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Welcome to the Rock Fight. Where we speak our truth, slay sacred cows and some sass.

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